Using Lagrangian to show a particle has a circular orbit

Click For Summary
SUMMARY

This discussion focuses on using the Lagrangian formulation to demonstrate that a particle can maintain a circular orbit under specific conditions. The Lagrangian is defined as L = (1/2)m(ṙ² + r²θ̇² + ṡ²) - er²g(z)θ̇, leading to conserved quantities such as the Hamiltonian H = (1/2)m(ṙ² + r²θ̇ + ṡ²) and generalized momentum pₜₕₑₜₐ = mr²θ̇ - er²g(z). The analysis shows that for a circular orbit, the condition g'(z) = 0 must hold, particularly when considering perturbations along the z-axis. The discussion concludes that small perturbations can lead to simple harmonic motion if g''(z₀) > 0, confirming the stability of the circular orbit.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of Lagrangian mechanics and its applications in classical dynamics.
  • Familiarity with Hamiltonian mechanics and the concept of conserved quantities.
  • Knowledge of Taylor series expansions and their use in perturbation analysis.
  • Basic concepts of simple harmonic motion (SHM) and stability conditions.
NEXT STEPS
  • Study the derivation and implications of the Euler-Lagrange equations in classical mechanics.
  • Learn about the stability analysis of dynamical systems, focusing on perturbation methods.
  • Explore the relationship between Lagrangian and Hamiltonian formulations in more complex systems.
  • Investigate the physical significance of potential functions and their derivatives in orbital mechanics.
USEFUL FOR

Students and professionals in physics, particularly those studying classical mechanics, dynamical systems, and orbital dynamics. This discussion is beneficial for anyone looking to deepen their understanding of Lagrangian mechanics and its applications to particle motion.

gromit
Messages
3
Reaction score
1
Homework Statement
The motion of an electron of mass m and charge (-e) moving in a magnetic
field: ##B = \nabla \times A(r)## is described by the Lagrangian
##L = \frac{1}{2}mv^2 - ev \cdot A(r)##

Working in cylindrical polar coordinates, consider the vector potential:
##A = (0, rg(z), 0)##
where ##g(z) > 0##:
1.) Obtain two constants of motion
2.) Show that if the electron is projected from a point ##(r_0, θ_0, z_0)## with velocity ##\dot{r} = \dot{z} = 0## and ##\dot{θ} = \frac{2eg(z_0)}{m}##, then it will describe a circular orbit provided that ##g'(z_0) = 0##
3.) Show that these orbits are stable to shifts along the z axis if ##tg′′ > 0##
Relevant Equations
##L = \frac{1}{2}mv^2 - ev \cdot A(r)##
##A = (0, rg(z), 0)##
Hi :) This is a problem from David Tong's Classical Dynamics course, found here: http://www.damtp.cam.ac.uk/user/tong/dynamics.html. In particular it is problem 6ii in the first problem sheet.

Firstly we can see the lagrangian is ##L = \frac{1}{2}m(\dot{r}^2+r^2\dot{\theta}^2+\dot{z}^2) - er^2g(z)\dot{\theta}##. From this it has symmetry in time and ##\theta## so the hamiltonian and generalised momentum for ##\theta## must be conserved. I found these to be:
$$H = \frac{1}{2}m(\dot{r}^2+r^2\dot{\theta}+\dot{z}^2)$$
$$p_{\theta} = mr^2\dot{\theta} - er^2g(z)$$
So these will be the two constants of motion. The next part is where I get a little shaky. I assume that you could consider the circle:
$$r(t) = r_0$$
$$\theta(t) = \frac{2eg(z_0)}{m}t + \theta_0$$
$$z(t) = z_0$$
And show that this satisfies the equations of motion derived from the Lagrangian (as well as the given boundary conditions). Namely:
$$m\ddot{r}+2erg(z)\dot{\theta} - mr^2\dot{\theta} = 0$$
$$(mr^2\dot{\theta} - er^2g(z))' = 0$$
$$m\ddot{z} + er^2g'(z)\dot{\theta} = 0$$
Then this part is solved (please correct me if I'm wrong). Substitution does show that the described solutions works for the first two, and it must be assumed that ##g'(z) = 0## for the last equation of motion to be satisfied. On a side note, if this is a valid method, could I just use the constants of motion instead and that would still be sufficient?

The final part is where I am completely stuck. It seems to me that the trajectory remaining a circular orbit for a shift in the z-axis relies on ##g'(z) = 0##, but the inequality provided does not guarantee this for an arbitrary shift?

Thank you so much for your help :)
 
Physics news on Phys.org
I wonder what is meant here by "stable under shifts along the z axis"? I'm sure it cannot be, say, a change in the initial conditions ##z_0 \mapsto z_0 + \alpha##, because ##z_0## is already arbitrary making the statement obvious.

So is he talking about making a small pertubation ##z = z_0 + \xi##, and then showing that ##\xi## oscillates simple harmonically provided the condition is satisfied?
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: gromit
ergospherical said:
I wonder what is meant here by "stable under shifts along the z axis"? I'm sure it cannot be, say, a change in the initial conditions ##z_0 \mapsto z_0 + \alpha##, because ##z_0## is already arbitrary making the statement obvious.

So is he talking about making a small pertubation ##z = z_0 + \xi##, and then showing that ##\xi## oscillates simple harmonically provided the condition is satisfied?
That makes much more sense, thank you!
 
As a hint, you could substitute ##z = z_0 + \xi## into the equation of motion ##m\ddot{z} + er^2g'(z)\dot{\theta} = 0## for ##z## and then Taylor expand ##g(z_0 + \xi)## to first order in ##\xi##. If ##g''(z_0) > 0## then the resulting equation of motion for ##\xi## is one of SHM with an equilibrium position displaced from the origin, and a substitution allows you to calculate ##\xi##. This is assuming that we can take ##\dot{\theta}## to be approximately constant in the perturbed case.

Again I'm not sure if that's correct, but it seems reasonable...?
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: vanhees71
ergospherical said:
As a hint, you could substitute ##z = z_0 + \xi## into the equation of motion ##m\ddot{z} + er^2g'(z)\dot{\theta} = 0## for ##z## and then Taylor expand ##g(z_0 + \xi)## to first order in ##\xi##. If ##g''(z_0) > 0## then the resulting equation of motion is one of SHM with an equilibrium position displaced from the origin, and a substitution allows you to calculate ##\xi##. This is assuming that we can take ##\dot{\theta}## to be approximately constant in the perturbed case.

Again I'm not sure if that's correct, but it seems reasonable...?
I just went through this roughly by hand, and it seems to answer it perfectly. Thanks again!
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: vanhees71

Similar threads

Replies
6
Views
2K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
3K
  • · Replies 21 ·
Replies
21
Views
5K
  • · Replies 16 ·
Replies
16
Views
2K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
3K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
6K
Replies
10
Views
2K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
3K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
9K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
3K