Velocity of 2-dimensional and 3-dimensional waves

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    Velocity Waves
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the velocity of waves in different dimensions, specifically focusing on 2-dimensional and 3-dimensional waves, including water waves and elastic waves. Participants explore the conditions under which wave velocity may be considered constant and question assumptions made in classical texts regarding wave behavior.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes that classical texts assume constant wave velocity for all types of waves but questions this assumption for circular waves, suggesting that the amplitude decreases with distance.
  • Another participant challenges the idea that mass per unit length (\mu) could vary with radius (r), arguing that the wave equations are homogeneous and material properties should remain constant throughout the medium.
  • A third participant elaborates on the previous point, suggesting that if the medium were conceptualized as a rope, the mass per unit length would not apply in higher dimensions, advocating for mass per unit area or volume instead.
  • One participant expresses confusion and requests proof for the constancy of wave velocity in 2- and 3-dimensional waves, indicating a desire for clarity on the topic.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the assumptions regarding wave velocity and the properties of the medium. There are competing views on whether mass per unit length can vary and how to properly conceptualize wave propagation in different dimensions.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight limitations in the discussion, such as the dependence on definitions of mass per unit characteristics and the assumption of homogeneity in the medium. There is also a recognition that the analogy of a rope may not adequately represent the physical behavior of waves in bulk materials.

atat1tata
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My book (an old copy of Halliday-Resnick) gives a proof for the fact that the wave velocity is constant in 1-dimensional transversal elastic waves, but it says nothing about other types of waves. Basically it makes a tacit assumption that all waves have constant velocity.
However it proves that the amplitude of a circular wave (a ripple in water) decreases proportionally to [tex]\frac{1}{r^2}[/tex]. I think that it assumes that the wave velocity is constant.
From another point of view if one uses cowishly the relation [tex]v^2 = \frac{T}{\mu}[/tex] one could say that, at least for an elastic circular wave, [tex]\mu[/tex] is proportional to [tex]r[/tex] and the wave velocity should vary.
As you can see I'm a bit confused and I would like to ask if someone could at least provide me with a proof of why the wave velocity is constant in water waves, 2- and 3-dimensional elastic waves and acoustic waves.

PS: I would be extremely grateful if someone could correct my English where I made mistakes in the language
 
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Why would \mu be proportional to r? These are homogeneous wave equations (I assume) meaning that the material properties in regards to the wave characteristics are constant throughout the medium.
 
Born2bwire said:
Why would \mu be proportional to r? These are homogeneous wave equations (I assume) meaning that the material properties in regards to the wave characteristics are constant throughout the medium.

If you think of the medium as a giant rope that starts at a points and gradually broadens to cover concentric increasing circles (you can think of a circular sector which constitutes the rope in the limiting case of an angle of 2pi) then the cross-section increases lineary and so does the mass per unit "length" of the rope. I understand this is a bit nonphysical, but I'd like to see a proof for the fact that velocity is constant for 2- and 3-dimensional waves
 
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No, that's not how it would work. Like I said, the medium is homogeneous, the inherent characteristics of the medium, like the mass density, would remain constant. Your first problem I think is using mass per unit length, that is a 1 dimensional characteristic. You need to do mass per unit area for two dimensions and volume for three dimensions. A 2D surface is a sheet, which you can deconstruct into an infinite number of ropes that radiate out of a single point, or in any other configuration should you desire I guess but ropes are a bad way of thinking because it restricts the propagation along the ropes. In bulk materials you can get shear and plane waves which would not exist together in your given rope configuration.
 

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