What Drives the Existence of Magnetism?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the question of why magnetism exists, exploring the philosophical and scientific implications of this inquiry. Participants engage with the nature of scientific explanations, the limits of current understanding, and the relationship between magnetism and other physical concepts such as electrostatics and relativity.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Philosophical

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants suggest that science may not be able to answer "why" questions in a fundamental sense, as these often lead to infinite regressions.
  • Others argue that while science can describe "how" magnetism operates, it does not provide answers to "why" it exists.
  • A few participants mention that magnetism can emerge from accepted principles like electrostatics and special relativity, referencing resources for further exploration.
  • One participant expresses the hope that future discoveries may provide insights into the relationship between magnetism and gravity, potentially leading to a deeper understanding.
  • There are discussions about the limitations of current theories, such as the Standard Model of particle physics, which does not fully explain the existence of fundamental forces.
  • Some participants highlight the philosophical implications of the question, noting that answers to "why" might fall outside the realm of scientific inquiry and into religious or philosophical domains.
  • One participant humorously suggests a mythological explanation for magnetism, indicating the diversity of perspectives on the topic.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that the question of "why" magnetism exists is complex and may not be answerable through current scientific frameworks. Multiple competing views remain regarding the nature of scientific inquiry and the philosophical implications of such questions.

Contextual Notes

Some discussions touch on the limitations of existing theories and the unresolved nature of fundamental questions in physics, indicating that the inquiry into "why" magnetism exists may depend on definitions and assumptions that are not universally accepted.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to those exploring the philosophical aspects of science, students of physics seeking to understand the foundational questions in their field, and anyone curious about the interplay between scientific inquiry and philosophical thought.

  • #31
fcacciola said:
That we haven't figure out a way to ask "nature" (or god, or paraphysical agents, or who/what-ever might happen to be beind all this) doesn't mean we never will.

How would you ever know that your answer is absolutely, 100%, correct?
That's what I see as the issue. You can make all the predictions you want, but you can never know whether your interpretation about what is going on is true or not.
 
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  • #32
Drakkith said:
How would you ever know that your answer is absolutely, 100%, correct?
That's what I see as the issue. You can make all the predictions you want, but you can never know whether your interpretation about what is going on is true or not.

Fair enough.

No doubt it is extremely useful to be able to predict with as much accuaracy as possible. In fact, all of technology is based on that. And, questions about why and, in rigor, what, are naturally outside such a "craft of prediction".

However, I don't see why we should constrain Science to only be such a craft.

The official argument (which you just presented) is that the matching ratio of predictions is the metric which allows the results of "such a craft" (I don't want to call it Science for I believe it ought to be consider a part of it) to be given a certainity. We can't be 100% sure of any physical explanation but we can be X% sure, where the fact that X is an (approximatedly) known figure what matters.

That makes sense, but so does locking up in my room because I can never know if I will be hit by a car, or some such, if I leave. So, is it really the case that Science cannot do better?

IIUC it was at the dawn of quantum physics where we (perhaps I should say you, I am not a physicist :) decided to give up and be happy with just making predictions, but, has such a position real epistemological value, or is it just a reaction to the ongoing failure to make any sense of the microscopic world? According to an article on Scientific American that I was reading last week, we don't even really know what the quantum field theory actually says, least what it means.

But, if not Science who is going to answer the fundamental question of what is really going on? it's great that we can make quantum computers, atom teleporting machines, spacetime bending warp travel ships, and all that, but that's technology and Science was never just the fuel of that.

So, what is better, not having absolutely any clue about a given thing, or having an hypothesis for which its certainity level has to be given by a metric which is not at all based on matching predictions. One which in fact cannot be related to any prediction at all?

You are of course right that all that matters is whether we know or just believe, for it is that which separates Science from everything else, but giving up on how to test it just because we haven't figure out how to do it yet, except for the narrow case of predictions against experiments, is leaving a big hole in knowledege that just can't and won't be filled by anything else.
I would argue that matching predictions cannot be the only way to asses the certainity of an explanation, and, if such a certainity can be qualified in some other way, then it is a scientific explanation.
 
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  • #33
I'm sorry, but I have no idea what you just said.
 
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  • #34
This thread has seriously gone off-topic.

Closed, pending moderation

Zz.
 
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