What is the proper grammar for my example sentence?

  • #71
timmeister37
124
25
The following is my rule in post #27:

As i recall, the rule for which pronoun case to use has to do with the verb form in the sentence. As i recall, if the sentence uses a linking verb to link the predicate pronoun back to the subject of the sentence, then the predicate pronoun should be the subjective case (she). If the sentence does not use a linking verb to link the predicate pronoun back to the subject of the sentence, then the predicate pronoun should be the objective case (her). The only linking verb that matters for this rule is the linking verb that separates the subject from the predicate in the sentence, not any other linking verb in this sentence.

I think i might have found a flaw in my rule in post #27. My post #27 says the following: If the sentence does not use a linking verb to link the predicate pronoun back to the subject of the sentence, then the predicate pronoun should be the objective case (her).
Consider the following sentence: I am smarter than she.

I know that "I am smarter than she" is correct grammar.

Is "am smarter" a linking verb?
 
  • #72
timmeister37
124
25
I would like to see sentential examples.
There is an example in my post #71.
 
  • #73
sysprog
2,613
1,783
I think i might have found a flaw in my rule in post #27. My post #27 says the following: If the sentence does not use a linking verb to link the predicate pronoun back to the subject of the sentence, then the predicate pronoun should be the objective case (her).
Consider the following sentence: I am smarter than she.

I know that "I am smarter than she" is correct grammar.

Is "am smarter" a linking verb?
I would say 'I am taller than she is' (2 instances of the 'esse' (to be) verb) -- in my view, your sentence does not include a 'linking' verb, but I don't use that terminology . . .
 
  • #74
Evo
Mentor
23,925
3,264
This isn't the homework forum. Thread closed pending deletion.
 
  • #75
36,658
8,656
This isn't the homework forum. Thread closed pending deletion.
I'm almost certain this isn't a homework question.
 
  • #76
Evo
Mentor
23,925
3,264
I'm almost certain this isn't a homework question.
It's definitely "homework like" and if it's this much like homework, it goes in homework, that's always been our rule. The information here would be of benefit to any student with similar school work.
 
  • #77
36,658
8,656
As i recall, the rule for which pronoun case to use has to do with the verb form in the sentence. As i recall, if the sentence uses a linking verb to link the predicate pronoun back to the subject of the sentence, then the predicate pronoun should be the subjective case (she). If the sentence does not use a linking verb to link the predicate pronoun back to the subject of the sentence, then the predicate pronoun should be the objective case (her).
I think this is correct. The only linking verb (this is terminology I don't recall from when I was learning grammar) is "to be," in its various conjugations, tenses, and moods. I won't swear to this, though,.
Is "am smarter" a linking verb?
No, just "am." Here the adjective "smarter" modifies the subject, "I."
I would say 'I am taller than she is'
"I am taller than she" is also correct. The final "is" is implied.
 
  • #78
36,658
8,656
It's definitely "homework like" and if it's this much like homework, it goes in homework, that's always been our rule. The information here would be of benefit to any student with similar school work.
No, not homework-like. I've been involved with the thread since the beginning. The OP is just curious about how pronouns work in English.

Aside from not being homework, we don't have a Homework section devoted to English grammar.

Please leave the thread open...
 
  • Like
Likes timmeister37
  • #79
sysprog
2,613
1,783
Well, thanks for re-opening the thread, and for not deleting it -- I understand that's it's not really physics, but I for one think that it's interesting.
 
  • Like
Likes timmeister37
  • #80
phinds
Science Advisor
Insights Author
Gold Member
2022 Award
18,135
10,966
Well, thanks for re-opening the thread, and for not deleting it -- I understand that's it's not really physics, but I for one think that it's interesting.
There's no requirement that things in general discussion have to be any STEM topics
 
  • Like
Likes timmeister37 and sysprog
  • #81
Evo
Mentor
23,925
3,264
There's no requirement that things in general discussion have to be any STEM topics
But if it's presented like the OP's first post, it would be considered homework. Also, the OP's attitude is inappropriate.
 
  • Like
Likes Mary Conrads Sanburn and phinds
  • #82
hutchphd
Science Advisor
Homework Helper
2022 Award
5,336
4,499
Again I feel I must be missing what the fuss is about.
The word in question is the object of a preposition. What else is required??
 
  • #83
sysprog
2,613
1,783
But if it's presented like the OP's first post, it would be considered homework. Also, the OP's attitude is inappropriate.
Well, even though I'm just a regular member, I to some extent concur with you regarding your pointing out of inappropriateness, and I detested the way @PeroK was treated, although I'm confident that he's amply capable of handling things himself ##\cdots##
 
  • Like
Likes etotheipi and Evo
  • #84
hutchphd
Science Advisor
Homework Helper
2022 Award
5,336
4,499
I think we should mention it once if we are offended and then stop communicating if it continues. Not a big deal...sort of self correcting.
And one can certainly be offended by bad treatment of others... and mention same.
 
  • Like
Likes Evo and sysprog
  • #85
phinds
Science Advisor
Insights Author
Gold Member
2022 Award
18,135
10,966
I think we should mention it once if we are offended and then stop communicating if it continues
I disagree. It is inappropriate to insult another member and to CONTINUE to do it is totally unacceptable. We should report that, not ignore it.
 
  • #86
36,658
8,656
I to some extent concur with you regarding your pointing out of inappropriateness, and I detested the way @PeroK was treated,
This occurred some 50 or 60 posts back, and was pointed out to the OP, who seems to have mended his ways.
 
  • Like
Likes timmeister37
  • #87
hutchphd
Science Advisor
Homework Helper
2022 Award
5,336
4,499
I disagree. It is inappropriate to insult another member and to CONTINUE to do it is totally unacceptable. We should report that, not ignore it.

I think it is better left to the aggrieved party at that point. If they are not sufficiently offended it seems a little bit of a reach to intervene. To each his own.

.
 
  • #88
OCR
953
876
.
Lol, that's some fancy formatting. . . but I've never seen the "# # \cdots # #" used before.

It does seem to work, though. . . . 🤔

Well, even though I'm just a regular member, I to some extent concur with you regarding your pointing out of inappropriateness, and I detested the way @PeroK was treated, although I'm confident that he's amply capable of handling things himself ##\cdots##


1587858588507.png


.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Likes atyy and sysprog
  • #89
PeroK
Science Advisor
Homework Helper
Insights Author
Gold Member
2022 Award
23,721
15,330
Since this is rumbling on, I wouldn't worry about me.
 
  • Like
  • Sad
Likes hutchphd, hmmm27, etotheipi and 1 other person
  • #90
timmeister37
124
25
As i said upthread, about ten years ago, i researched this issue in depth. I found an excellent grammar textbook at my local public library. The English grammar textbook i found was John E. Warriner's textbook English Grammar and Composition. With Warriner's textbook English Grammar and Composition, the rules for when one must use the subjective case and when one must use the objective case were crystal clear, and it made so much sense! One thing i remember about the rule that Warriner stated was that i had to know whether or not a verb was intransitive verb or a transitive verb to know whether or not i should use the subjective case or the objective case. I am going to either buy Warriner's textbook or get it on interlibrary loan.
My purpose on this thread is to get a deep understanding of the rules as to which pronoun case to use. I will share this information with everyone on the thread who wants to know as soon as i acquire it.

Although i do think that my rule on post #27 is on the right track, I don't think the rule i posted on post #27 is 100% complete to give one the correct pronoun case 100 % of the time.

P.S. no, this is not a homework question. I don't attend any school. I am on OTR truck driver.
 
  • Like
Likes atyy and sysprog
  • #91
hutchphd
Science Advisor
Homework Helper
2022 Award
5,336
4,499
As i said upthread, about ten years ago, i researched this issue in depth. I found an excellent grammar textbook at my local public library. The English grammar textbook i found was John E. Warriner's textbook English Grammar and Composition. With Warriner's textbook English Grammar and Composition, the rules for when one must use the subjective case and when one must use the objective case were crystal clear, and it made so much sense! One thing i remember about the rule that Warriner stated was that i had to know whether or not a verb was intransitive verb or a transitive verb to know whether or not i should use the subjective case or the objective case. I am going to either buy Warriner's textbook or get it on interlibrary loan.
My purpose on this thread is to get a deep understanding of the rules as to which pronoun case to use. I will share this information with everyone on the thread who wants to know as soon as i acquire it.

Although i do think that my rule on post #27 is on the right track, I don't think the rule i posted on post #27 is 100% complete to give one the correct pronoun case 100 % of the time.

P.S. no, this is not a homework question. I don't attend any school. I am on OTR truck driver.
Again I feel I must be missing what the fuss is about.
The word in question is the object of a preposition. What else is required??
 
  • #92
sysprog
2,613
1,783
timmeister37 said:
P.S. no, this is not a homework question. I don't attend any school. I am on OTR truck driver.
Thanks for bringing people stuff -- if a person got something it was probably transported by a truck driver -- bless you Sir . . .
 
  • Like
Likes timmeister37 and hutchphd
  • #93
timmeister37
124
25
The answer to that question is in the last post i made before this one.
 
  • #94
hutchphd
Science Advisor
Homework Helper
2022 Award
5,336
4,499
Please quote the answer because I cannot find it in your post...we must be miscommunicating
 
  • #95
sysprog
2,613
1,783
Please quote the answer because I cannot find it in your post...we must be miscommunicating
@timmeister37 how does @hutchphd know where you put what? -- or to put it another way -- please don't try too hard to police the thread -- even if it's your thread started by you, if you're not a mentor/moderator here . . .
 
  • #96
sysprog
2,613
1,783
.
Lol, that's some fancy formatting. . . but I've never seen the "# # \cdots # #" used before.

It does seem to work, though. . . . 🤔




View attachment 261449

.
We got to love Professor Don Knuth's ##\TeX \cdots##
 
  • #97
timmeister37
124
25
hutchphd, this is what the fuss is about.


My purpose on this thread is to get a deep understanding of the rules as to which pronoun case to use. I will share this information with everyone on the thread who wants to know as soon as i acquire it.
 
  • #98
timmeister37
124
25
@timmeister37 how does @hutchphd know where you put what? -- or to put it another way -- please don't try too hard to police the thread -- even if it's your thread started by you, if you're not a mentor/moderator here . . .
I am not policing the thread. I am just stating the new purpose of the thread.
 
  • #99
36,658
8,656
My purpose on this thread is to get a deep understanding of the rules as to which pronoun case to use. I will share this information with everyone on the thread who wants to know as soon as i acquire it.
The rule is fairly simple: If a pronoun is in the subject, use the subjective or nominative case: I, he, she, we, they, who. I'm borrowing this term, nominative case, from other languages with inflected noun and pronoun forms, such as Latin, German, Russian, and all other Slavic languages.
If a pronoun is an object, either direct or indirect, use the objective form: me, him, her, us, them, whom.

The two rules above cover most situations.

A special case is a linking verb, which includes all forms of to be and a few others, that is used with a pronoun. In formal English, the answer to the question "Who is there?" would be "It is I". The less formal "It is me" is commonly used, but would raise objections from strict grammarians.

Another special case is a prepositional phrase, in which a more-or-less complete sentence (a clause) follows a preposition. For example, should I use whoever or whomever in this sentence? "I will give $20 to _____________ helps me find my lost keys."
The correct choice here between whoever and whomever is whoever, because whoever is the subjective form that acts as the subject in the clause following the preposition "to."

In contrast, "I will give $20 to whomover." would be correct for this example, since whomever is not the subject of a clause (and in fact never can be the subject, any more than him, her, us, or them could be.

This business with pronouns in prepositional phrases/clauses is about as sticky as pronoun rules get. I would bet that less than 50% of native English speakers would know this.
 
  • Like
Likes sysprog and timmeister37
  • #100
OCR
953
876
.
Well, that's plum neato. . . . 😏

We got to love Professor Don Knuth's ##\TeX \ ~\cdots\vdots\dots\vdots\cdots\ ~## 😉

.
 
  • #101
sysprog
2,613
1,783
.
Well, that's plum neato. . . . 😏
.
You misquoted me (I didn't use \vdots or repeat \cdots, both of which you did in falsely quoting me), and it's not 'plum', as in the name of the fruit; it's 'plumb', as in the name of the metal . . . 😌

If you're going to quote someone please use what he or she actually said.

He can never not have said it if he said it.
 
Last edited:
  • #102
OCR
953
876
You misquoted me. . .


Indeed. . . and I can only offer my sincerest apologies. . :redface:


Carry on. . .
.
 
  • #103
sysprog
2,613
1,783
sysprog said:
You misquoted me
Indeed. . . and I can only offer my sincerest apologies. . :redface:

Carry on. . ..
ok smart aleck :wink:
 
  • #104
timmeister37
124
25
Is anyone on this thread other than me familiar with John E. Warriner's textbook English Grammar and Composition? If so, please share your thoughts on the book?
 

Suggested for: What is the proper grammar for my example sentence?

  • Last Post
Replies
16
Views
318
  • Last Post
Replies
6
Views
363
  • Last Post
Replies
12
Views
427
  • Last Post
Replies
8
Views
161
Replies
7
Views
431
  • Last Post
Replies
12
Views
439
Replies
20
Views
832
  • Last Post
Replies
7
Views
640
Top