What is the relationship between QFT and QM?

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    Qft Qm Relationship
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Discussion Overview

The discussion explores the relationship between Quantum Mechanics (QM) and Quantum Field Theory (QFT), examining whether QM is a subset of QFT, the differences in their formulations, and the implications of second quantization. The scope includes theoretical considerations and conceptual clarifications.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants suggest that QM and QFT are fundamentally different theories, noting differences in variables and formulations, such as the use of position variables in QM and the absence of a wave function in QFT.
  • Others argue that both theories share common postulates, such as unitarity and cluster decomposition, and that classical mechanics can be derived from QFT, raising questions about the relationship between the two.
  • A participant points out that QFT involves an infinite number of degrees of freedom, contrasting it with the finite degrees of freedom in QM, and highlights the need for renormalization in QFT due to infinite quantities.
  • Another participant emphasizes that there is only one quantum theory, with QFT being the most comprehensive form, while noting that non-relativistic approximations of QM are often sufficient for many physical problems.
  • Questions are raised about the nature of second quantization in QM and whether it is equivalent to traditional QM, as well as its relationship to QFT.
  • Some participants reference specific lecture notes and texts that discuss the connection between QFT and the Schrödinger equation, suggesting that second quantization may bridge the two theories.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on whether QM is a subset of QFT, with some asserting a fundamental distinction and others suggesting a deeper connection. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the equivalence of second quantization in QM and its implications for understanding the relationship between QM and QFT.

Contextual Notes

Participants note limitations in the traditional teaching of QM versus QFT, questioning why QM is often presented separately despite potential connections through second quantization.

  • #31
meopemuk said:
Strictly speaking, QFT is about variable number of particles.

No, it isn't, because there are quantum field states that do not even have a particle interpretation. The fundamental objects in quantum field theory are fields, not particles.
 
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  • #32
meopemuk said:
Strictly speaking, QFT is about variable number of particles.
No. A quantum field theory is primarily about fields, as the name says. Particles appear in general only as approximate asymptotic concepts.

Starting with them is just a didactical tradition.
 
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  • #33
meopemuk said:
As far as I understand, the "perturbative/nonperturbative" refers to the method chosen to calculate the S-matrix (including the lifetime of positronium). If you are lucky, you can do that without using the perturbation series, but in most cases it is easier to use the perturbative approach. The chosen calculation method should not have any effect on the (Fock) structure of the Hilbert space. The Fock space structure simply tells you that numbers of particles are good quantum-mechanical observables that commute with each other. So, each Fock sector is a common eigenspace of all particle number operators in the theory.
The particle number operator cannot be renormalized in the standard perturbation scheme. To get finite results one needs to renormalize, and to get approximate lifetimes, one needs to sum infinite number of renormalized diagrams - which is neither fixed order perturbation theory nor doable in Fock space.

In your personal approach to QED, you get a renormalized particle number operator by using a nonstandard formulation with a nonstandard perturbation theory, but then you can no longer determine what to sum to get the lifetimes. At least you haven't shown that you can...
 
  • #34
A. Neumaier said:
The particle number operator cannot be renormalized in the standard perturbation scheme. To get finite results one needs to renormalize, and to get approximate lifetimes, one needs to sum infinite number of renormalized diagrams - which is neither fixed order perturbation theory nor doable in Fock space.

I don't quite understand... In the standard renormalization procedure we add counterterms to the Hamiltonian to make sure that the S-matrix is finite and satisfies a few renormalization conditions. Why would we want to renormalize the particle number operator? Are you talking about the Greenberg-Schweber transition to "dressed particles"? Or something else?

Besides, in QED we are dealing with stable particles - photons, electrons, protons. What the "lifetimes" have to do with them?

Eugene.
 
  • #35
meopemuk said:
Why would we want to renormalize the particle number operator?
Because unrenormalized operators have no meaning in the renormalized theory - all expectations containing it are ill-defined.
meopemuk said:
Besides, in QED we are dealing with stable particles - photons, electrons, protons. What the "lifetimes" have to do with them?
Positronium is an unstable composite particle which has a finite lifetime computable by QED.
 

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