Whitehouse Correspondent's Dinner

[turbo]

The birther issue isn't going away any time soon, Ivan. Orly Taitz is arguing before the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals, claiming that the long-form birth certificate is a fake.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/05/02/obama-birth-certificate-c_0_n_856645.html

In my safe, I have hospital-issued certificates of live birth for myself and my wife. Guess what? When I needed to get a passport on rather short notice, I found out that my orignal birth certificate was not acceptable. I had to go to the county office, and pay a fee to have a clerk research birth records, transcribe, notarize and seal a short-form birth certificate on security paper. Apart from document numbers and the pre-printed header, it looks just like the certificate that Obama released during the campaign. That was the legal document that the US government demanded.

Unfortunately, people can play racists and conspiracy-theorists for fools just by flogging this dead issue.

 

[Energystrom]

http://factcheck.org/2011/04/donald-youre-fired/

"The U.S. Department of State uses "birth certificate" as a generic term to include the official Hawaii document, which satisfies legal requirements for proving citizenship and obtaining a passport."

 

[Evo]

The birther issue isn't going away any time soon, Ivan. Orly Taitz is arguing before the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals, claiming that the long-form birth certificate is a fake.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/05/02/obama-birth-certificate-c_0_n_856645.html

In my safe, I have hospital-issued certificates of live birth for myself and my wife. Guess what? When I needed to get a passport on rather short notice, I found out that my orignal birth certificate was not acceptable. I had to go to the county office, and pay a fee to have a clerk research birth records, transcribe, notarize and seal a short-form birth certificate on security paper. Apart from document numbers and the pre-printed header, it looks just like the certificate that Obama released during the campaign. That was the legal document that the US government demanded.

Unfortunately, people can play racists and conspiracy-theorists for fools just by flogging this dead issue.

Turbo, long form birth certificates are the standard for passports, sometimes they will accept the short form, but not always.

*A certified birth certificate has a registrar's raised, embossed, impressed or multicolored seal, registrar's signature, and the date the certificate was filed with the registrar's office, which must be within 1 year of your birth. Please note, some short (abstract) versions of birth certificates may not be acceptable for passport purposes.

http://travel.state.gov/passport/get/first/first_830.html#step3first

Specifically in Maine you could not get a passport with a short form birth certificate.

Completed, unsigned application
Certified long-form birth certificate or previous U. S. Passport
Identification — Picture ID (current driver’s license for example)
Two passport photos
Two personal checks for payment

http://cumberlandmaine.com/government/departments/library/passports/

More here http://www.cityoforange.org/depts/cityclerk/passport.asp

 

[turbo]

Turbo, long form birth certificates are the standard for passports, sometimes they will accept the short form, but not always.

They didn't accept my original. It was good enough to identify myself to Selective Service, schools, etc, but not to get a passport. I needed a notarized certificate from the county registrar - then no problem.

Apparently, documentary standards from 60 years back just didn't meet State's requirements for identification to obtain a passport. I got that passport in '88 or '89, IIR.

 

[Evo]

They didn't accept my original. It was good enough to identify myself to Selective Service, schools, etc, but not to get a passport. I needed a notarized certificate from the county registrar - then no problem.

Apparently, documentary standards from 60 years back just didn't meet State's requirements for identification to obtain a passport. I got that passport in '88 or '89, IIR.

Then it was a certified copy of your long form certificate.

When Evo Child had to get a passport, I also had to send off for a copy of her original long form birth certificate.

 

[turbo]

Then it was a certified copy of your long form certificate.

When Evo Child had to get a passport, I also had to send off for a copy of her original long form birth certificate.

Nope, it's a certified short form. I have that out in my safe, and it looks just like the one Obama released during the campaign. If the birthers are right, my SS account is bogus because SS accepted my original photostatic copy for ID when I was 14 and got my first "real' job with withholding, etc.

Things might have changed a lot at State since 9-11, with much tighter standards. The lady at the Federal office in Augusta told me that my original certificate was unacceptable, and that I'd have to get a certified copy at the county office. That paper has my parents' names and birthplaces, my date of birth, and other basic stuff. No time or birth or name of attending physician, like my original photostat has.

 

[Char. Limit]

Funny, when I clicked "Whitehouse Correspondent's Dinner" I expected a conversation on, oh, I dunno, the White House Correspondent's Dinner. Not another thread on the Birther issue.

As it is, I recommend this thread be renamed to "Birther issue" and moved to the P&WA forum. Over 80% of the posts are on that issue, after all.

 

[turbo]

Funny, when I clicked "Whitehouse Correspondent's Dinner" I expected a conversation on, oh, I dunno, the White House Correspondent's Dinner. Not another thread on the Birther issue.

As it is, I recommend this thread be renamed to "Birther issue" and moved to the P&WA forum. Over 80% of the posts are on that issue, after all.

I think at least 80% of the discussion at the Correspondents Dinner were on the same subject, and how it just won't get put to rest. I'd have to say that Obama's Lion King "birth video" was a good touch, though.

 

[Evo]

No, the short form is the official legal proof of his citizenship and the long form isn't even legal anymore. The LF is not a legal document. This is determined by the State of Hawaii. They made a special exception in releasing the original, non-legal form.

Actually, the long form is legal and is actually preferred. It's just that when a copy of a birth certificate is requested they send the short form.

Primary Documents

Birth certificates (Certificates of Live Birth and Certifications of Live Birth) and Certificates of Hawaiian Birth are the primary documents used to determine native Hawaiian qualification.

The Department of Hawaiian Home Lands accepts both Certificates of Live Birth (original birth certificate) and Certifications of Live Birth because they are official government records documenting an individual’s birth. The Certificate of Live Birth generally has more information which is useful for genealogical purposes as compared to the Certification of Live Birth which is a computer-generated printout that provides specific details of a person’s birth. Although original birth certificates (Certificates of Live Birth) are preferred for their greater detail, the State Department of Health (DOH) no longer issues Certificates of Live Birth. When a request is made for a copy of a birth certificate, the DOH issues a Certification of Live Birth.

http://hawaii.gov/dhhl/applicants/appforms/applyhhl

 

[Evo]

Nope, it's a certified short form. I have that out in my safe, and it looks just like the one Obama released during the campaign. If the birthers are right, my SS account is bogus because SS accepted my original photostatic copy for ID when I was 14 and got my first "real' job with withholding, etc.

Things might have changed a lot a State since 9-11, with much tighter standards. The lady at the Federal office in Augusta told me that my original certificate was unacceptable, and that I'd have to get a certified copy at the county office. That paper has my parents' names and birthplaces, my date of birth, and other basic stuff. No time or birth or name of attending physician, like my original photostat has.

Unless your original was missing something, did it have a raised embossed seal? Or perhaps she didn't know what she was talking about, a *valid* long form is always preferred. It can't be the certificate from the hospital.

 

[turbo]

Unless your original was missing something, did it have a raised embossed seal? Or perhaps she didn't know what she was talking about, a *valid* long form is always preferred. It can't be the certificate from the hospital.

I've got no idea what her objection was. She said that I had to get a certificate from the county registrar, so I hustled right back there and got one and got right back down to the Federal office. Like I said, time was running tight, and even though the State Department was not jammed up that badly ~22 years ago, there could be delays, so I needed the passport ASAP.

There was a lot more information on the original than on the certified copy that the county registrar issued, but like I said, standards had probably changed since 1952. Good enough to sign up for Social Security, good enough to get a draft card, good enough for all kinds of purposes over the years, but not sufficient for a passport in ~'88. I'd hate to have to try to get a new passport now in the wake of 9-11. I imagine the requirements are much more stringent than when I got mine. No matter - I don't travel at all now, except in my own vehicles and it's all domestic.

 

[Evo]

I'd hate to have to try to get a new passport now in the wake of 9-11. I imagine the requirements are much more stringent than when I got mine. No matter - I don't travel at all now, except in my own vehicles and it's all domestic.

I dread what I will have to go through to get a new passport, both of my passports disappeared (French & US) at the same time a few years ago. I'm probably on some terrorist list now.

 

[turbo]

I dread what I will have to go through to get a new passport, both of my passports disappeared (French & US) at the same time a few years ago. I'm probably on some terrorist list now.

I'll wager that replacing the French one will be easier than replacing the US one, as long as you can get to a French consulate in the US.

 

[arildno]

From what Evo and IvanSeeking are saying here (and also a kind member who sent me information by PM), it seems that:

BOTH the "short form" and "long form" are documents that have some legal force (I was told that the "short form" is sufficient for court proceedings), but that there are some ambiguities (possibly with variations between US states, and also with respect to time periods) as to precisely in which contexts the documents have that legal force.

To me, at least, now, it seems that the short form ought to be enough for eligibility so I won't bother about this anymore.

I will, however, watch closely what your lemminghead is going to do next..

 

[turbo]

Specifically in Maine you could not get a passport with a short form birth certificate.

Well, I did, but that was ~22 years ago. Like I have mentioned repeatedly, the State Department might have tightened up it's standards drastically in that time (esp. after 9-11). I have no relevant links to 1988-1989 standards, but I DID get a passport with a county-issued notarized extract, not a "long-form". I'm not making this up. Frankly, I find the distinction between short-form and long-form with the emphasis on Obama's legitimacy, to be a game of moving the goal-posts on the part of people who want to want to discredit him at any cost. Orly Taitz said that Obama's extract certificate is fake, and was thrown out of court and fined $20,000 for her idiocy and exploiting the GA court system. Now, she's at the 9th court of appeals, and claims that the "long-form" birth certificate is a fake, too. There is no end to the idiocy.

 

[Newai]

Donald Trump was the only one not laughing

When Seth Meyers got going, I didn't laugh much either. He was funny for a while but then I (and others) started looking at our clocks.

 

[Chi Meson]

I think that decades will go by wherein the Correspondent's Dinner keynote speaker will be looking to Stephen Colbert's performance as the gold standard to beat.

I think I'll watch it again.

 

[turbo]

I think that decades will go by wherein the Correspondent's Dinner keynote speaker will be looking to Stephen Colbert's performance as the gold standard to beat.

I think I'll watch it again.

You get a big thumbs up on that one.

 

[Ryumast3r]

I dread what I will have to go through to get a new passport, both of my passports disappeared (French & US) at the same time a few years ago. I'm probably on some terrorist list now.

Getting the U.S. passport was really easy for me... I don't know why you're all that worried. I handed them my birth certificate, my drivers license, my two passport photos (that I just got at a local store... almost anywhere will do them), and the money, and they mailed me a passport ~ two weeks later.

They say you might have to wait up to like 8 weeks or so, but for me it was really fast. Time-consuming, yes, but they shouldn't give you all that much trouble at any rate.

 

[lisab]

I think that decades will go by wherein the Correspondent's Dinner keynote speaker will be looking to Stephen Colbert's performance as the gold standard to beat.

I think I'll watch it again.

Oh yes, it was brilliant !