Would it be possible for a black hole to have a "solar system"?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion explores the possibility of planets maintaining stable orbits around a black hole, considering factors such as gravitational dynamics, energy sources, and the implications of Hawking Radiation. It addresses theoretical aspects and potential scenarios without reaching a consensus.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that there is nothing fundamentally preventing planets from orbiting a black hole without spiraling in, assuming the black hole does not absorb significant mass.
  • Others argue that while stable orbits may be possible in the short term, the long-term stability is questionable due to the black hole's eventual evaporation through Hawking Radiation.
  • One participant questions why a planet orbiting a black hole would be more prone to spiraling in than one orbiting a star, suggesting similar gravitational dynamics.
  • Another participant notes that stable orbits around black holes are theoretically possible and compares the scenario to our solar system, indicating that replacing the Sun with a black hole would not immediately affect orbital stability, though it would lead to a colder environment.
  • Concerns are raised about gravitational wave emission from orbiting bodies, which could lead to energy loss and eventual spiraling in, although this effect is noted to be minimal for less dense objects like planets compared to black holes.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the long-term stability of orbits around black holes, with some asserting the possibility of stable orbits and others highlighting the challenges posed by Hawking Radiation and gravitational wave emission. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the feasibility of a stable planetary system around a black hole.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge the dependence on various assumptions, such as the mass of the black hole and the initial conditions of the planetary system. The discussion also highlights the complexity of gravitational dynamics in extreme environments.

BHL 20
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Was just wondering if there is anything fundamentally preventing a system of planets being in permanent orbit around a black hole, without ever spiralling in. Assuming that the black hole doesn't absorb any significant amount of additional mass. Of course I know it wouldn't provide any energy to the planets like a star does, but other than that would there be any differences?
 
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Permanently, no because over an unimaginably long period of time, the black hole will evaporate due to Hawking Radiation. In the short term it's likely there could be stable orbits for planets, BUT ... it's hard to see how they would get into stable orbits in the first place.
 
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BHL 20 said:
Was just wondering if there is anything fundamentally preventing a system of planets being in permanent orbit around a black hole, without ever spiralling in. Assuming that the black hole doesn't absorb any significant amount of additional mass. Of course I know it wouldn't provide any energy to the planets like a star does, but other than that would there be any differences?
They are called blanets:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blanet#:~:text=A blanet is a member,like planets that orbit stars.
 
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Why would a planet orbiting a black hole be any more prone to spiraling in than one orbiting a star?
 
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BHL 20 said:
Was just wondering if there is anything fundamentally preventing a system of planets being in permanent orbit around a black hole, without ever spiralling in.
There are stable orbits around black holes just like anything else, so yes you can have planets. Replacing the Sun with a one solar mass black hole would not affect our orbit, although as you note it would get very cold around here quite quickly. The process of turning a star into a black hole, though, is quite violent and I'd tend to suspect that any planets around one either formed or were captured after the black hole formed.

There are a couple of notes to that. First, as @phinds notes, black holes are predicted to evaporate. But the timescale for this is many times the age of the universe, so it's not an immediate worry. Second, all orbiting bodies emit gravitational waves which sap energy and cause them to spiral in. In the case of the Earth's orbit the emission is expected to be about 100W at 10-7Hz (undetectably tiny with almost any technology). The emission power depends strongly on the orbital radius and orbital speed, and it is this mechanism that causes very dense objects like black holes to spiral into each other - they can get very close to each other while going very fast and not disintegrate under the tidal forces, so they can emit powerful gravitational waves at high frequencies detectable to us and spiral in. But for the earth, you jumping up and down is a bigger effect.
 
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