Music Wow -- Electric Violin

[berkeman]

 

[DaveC426913]

I have one of those. (a cheap one). I decided I was going to once and for all see if I had inherited any of my family's musical talent.

Fiddle was my choice (because I'm into Indie/Folk/Americana music). I chose an electric fiddle so I could practice without driving the whole house crazy and being self-conscious about how bad I was.

Got a tiny amp and headphones to go with it. Took lessons for two or three years.

TL;DR: The answer is no; I have zero musical eptitude.

 

[Hornbein]

Violin is one of the hardest instruments. Guitar is maybe the easiest (excepting simple things like recorders). I think this explains the popularity of the latter. But electric guitarists may go to great lengths to get the instrument to sound a lot like a violin. Go into a guitar store and there is an endless variety of "distortion units" that have that purpose. Sustain! Spinal Tap was dead on about that. Eguitarists have superstitions about sustain.

This is a problem because chislers would go to a store, try out the units to find one they liked, then order it online. So IFAIK stores in the USA no longer provide that service. Instead you have to order the units online then send them back if you don't like them. I seem to recall I read an interview with this violinist in which she said she had to go through that a dozen times. I think stores should charge a fee like $20 to try out the units, refundable if you buy from them.

Natural "acoustic" guitar, you can learn to strum a few chords and make a good backup for singing. Unlike violin or saxophone or electric guitar, it's easy to get a good tone out of it.

As far as rock violin my fave is Emilie Autumn. Here's a tune she recorded for a horror movie. That phrase that begins at 2:08 grips me every single time. It never gets old.



Playing the violin like that is so demanding that Emilie gave it up a few years back. Better things to do.

 

[OmCheeto]

Violin is one of the hardest instruments. Guitar is maybe the easiest (excepting simple things like recorders).

Sorry to laugh, but the first instrument I learned was the violin, around the age of 9. I took all available classes in our public school system for the next 5 years.
Trying to play the guitar, for me, is basically impossible.
Whose idea was it to put all those lumps on the neck?

ps. It might have been that background that got me interested in Jean Luc Ponty, way back when.

per wiki; "Jean-Luc Ponty (born 29 September 1942) is a French jazz and jazz fusion violinist and composer. He is considered a pioneer of jazz-rock, particularly for his use of the electric violin starting in the 1970s."

 

[AlexB23]

View attachment 355351

That is a cool violin. I do not play instruments, but enjoy the variety in instruments nowadays.

Do you folks own any violins, electric or otherwise? What is your favorite style of violin music?

 

[nsaspook]

Sorry to laugh, but the first instrument I learned was the violin, around the age of 9. I took all available classes in our public school system for the next 5 years.
Trying to play the guitar, for me, is basically impossible.
Whose idea was it to put all those lumps on the neck?

ps. It might have been that background that got me interested in Jean Luc Ponty, way back when.

per wiki; "Jean-Luc Ponty (born 29 September 1942) is a French jazz and jazz fusion violinist and composer. He is considered a pioneer of jazz-rock, particularly for his use of the electric violin starting in the 1970s."

Jean-Luc Ponty, Love that guy.

 

[DennisN]

Violin is one of the hardest instruments.

Yes.

Do you folks own any violins, electric or otherwise?

Not me. I know my limitations.

I've tried cello once (I knew a cellist*) and it was very fun, cello is a lovely instrument.
But it requires much practice of course, the coordination requirement of the left hand and the right hand is not something you learn quickly. A guitar you can pretty much play right away (sort of). Not so with cellos, violas and violins; you really have to make them play (using the bow).

And an additional difficulty with violins is that the fingerboards are really small compared to e.g. guitars and cellos, which means small inaccuracies in where you place your finger(s) lead to large note inaccuracies.

* Actually I know a couple of professional classical musicians, including an opera singer and a cellist. I've recorded them live once.

What is your favorite style of violin music?

Mostly classical music for me.

Here is an unbelievably good violinist, playing a really difficult piece:

Paganini Caprice no.24 [HQ]


Edit: And here is a lovely cello piece, if I may...
It's Bach*, so it's good of course.
And a real treat for the soul.

Mischa Maisky plays Bach Cello Suite No.1 in G


* Sidenote:

Bach is STILL influencing musicians today, his legacy is incredible:
(a number of famous musicians are hailing Bach in the video below, e.g. the famous song A Whiter Shade Of Pale was directly influenced by Bach)

The Bach Effect: What the GREATS Hear That You Don’t (Rick Beato)

 

[Hornbein]

The cello is even harder to play in tune than the violin. Less ergonomic I guess.

In Tokyo I go to lots of classical concerts and competitions. However I never listen to recordings thereof. Classical music evolved to sound good in real life, while popular music of all kinds will do anything to get a good sound on a recording.

The level of skill at a Tokyo classical competition is incredible. Not only that, the public has very little interest. Tickets are cheap and sit wherever you like. With music you pay for fame, not quality.

As far as electric violin there are some bootleg recordings of the Mahavishnu Orchestra with Jerry Goodman that are terrific. There are dozens of soundboard tapes floating around. Their live performances improved as their official recordings went downhill. Go figure. Here's the most famed one.

I suppose that most people don't realize how revolutionary that all was. It was a big push for guitarists to move away from the blues and toward speed. Drummers were astonished, changed their style. Even their sound system was better than anything else that came before it (better transient response for more punch on the drums). Bands like Yes and Frank Zappa tried to copy what they did (their detriment, but understandable. After a while they came to their senses and gave up trying.)

 

[DennisN]

the Mahavishnu Orchestra

I've actually heard about them and listened to some. Interesting music.

 

[AlexB23]

Yes.


Not me. I know my limitations.

I've tried cello once (I knew a cellist*) and it was very fun, cello is a lovely instrument.
But it requires much practice of course, the coordination requirement of the left hand and the right hand is not something you learn quickly. A guitar you can pretty much play right away (sort of). Not so with cellos, violas and violins; you really have to make them play (using the bow).

And an additional difficulty with violins is that the fingerboards are really small compared to e.g. guitars and cellos, which means small inaccuracies in where you place your finger(s) lead to large note inaccuracies.

* Actually I know a couple of professional classical musicians, including an opera singer and a cellist. I've recorded them live once.



Mostly classical music for me.

Here is an unbelievably good violinist, playing a really difficult piece:

Paganini Caprice no.24 [HQ]


Edit: And here is a lovely cello piece, if I may...
It's Bach*, so it's good of course.
And a real treat for the soul.

Mischa Maisky plays Bach Cello Suite No.1 in G


* Sidenote:

Bach is STILL influencing musicians today, his legacy is incredible:
(a number of famous musicians are hailing Bach in the video below, e.g. the famous song A Whiter Shade Of Pale was directly influenced by Bach)

The Bach Effect: What the GREATS Hear That You Don’t (Rick Beato)

I guess we are similar, in that we both do not play violins or stringed instruments. Bach is one of my favorite classical musicians.

I did play violin for 5 seconds when trying out instruments before joining band class in 6th grade to decide between band and Orchestra. The teacher was surprised I played violin halfway well.

 

[Jonathan Scott]

I play the violin (also viola and piano) at a high amateur standard and my wife plays the cello. We've both played concerto movements with orchestra in informal public concerts (and I've played piano concerto movements too). I've been playing for 60 years or so (since I was 8). It does take a lot of work to get to the point where you don't mind being in the same room as yourself! However, the most important thing (as with any musical activity) is to try to listen to yourself objectively and play in the way you would like to hear it, rather than merely playing along with some imagined performance in your head.

I bought a Yamaha SV-110 electric violin quite a few years ago which I hoped would enable me to practise with less disturbance to others, using headphones, but I never got really comfortable with that solution, and there was quite a bit of background hiss too. And of course, I did not use any sort of electronic modification to the sound, unlike in the video above, as I was trying to improve my classical violin playing.

 

[AlexB23]

I play the violin (also viola and piano) at a high amateur standard and my wife plays the cello. We've both played concerto movements with orchestra in informal public concerts (and I've played piano concerto movements too). I've been playing for 60 years or so (since I was 8). It does take a lot of work to get to the point where you don't mind being in the same room as yourself! However, the most important thing (as with any musical activity) is to try to listen to yourself objectively and play in the way you would like to hear it, rather than merely playing along with some imagined performance in your head.

I bought a Yamaha SV-110 electric violin quite a few years ago which I hoped would enable me to practise with less disturbance to others, using headphones, but I never got really comfortable with that solution, and there was quite a bit of background hiss too. And of course, I did not use any sort of electronic modification to the sound, unlike in the video above, as I was trying to improve my classical violin playing.

Goes to show that a violin made out of a real tree has better quality compared to the electronic variety.

 

[Swamp Thing]

This thread reminded me about another one I started a while back, asking about the right way to saw wood.

After receiving a few good tips from PF members, I posted this:

Hi all, I just got home and decided to have a go with a bit of scrap wood, keeping these suggestions in mind. I'm doing a lot better than before!

Not pressing down too much seems to be a key point, plus getting the right angle between blade and surface (ideally, close to 0 degrees). In fact, I found that it helps to slightly increase the pressure on the pull stroke and to partially counter the weight of the saw on the push stroke.

I suspect that my muscle memory from my violin lessons (40+ years ago) is kicking in and helping to pull this off. Although I probably sound a lot better right now, sawing wood, than back then on the violin.

Edit: After sawing away for a couple more minutes, I realized that the comparison with the violin bow is actually more apt than I thought. It's a good idea to reduce the pressure just when the bow, uh, saw, changes direction, especially when pushing. Then, once it's moving freely, you can bear down (not too hard!) in order to get a bit more cutting done on the push strokes.

... to which phinds replied:

Now you've got it. It IS tricky when you're new to it.

 

[Astronuc]

Jean-Luc Ponty, Love that guy.

When I saw Electric Violin, I immediately thought of Jean-Luc. I collected most of his albums - on vinyl, then CD - when the vinyl was a bit worn, and the phonograph got damaged (too may moves).

 

[Hornbein]

I'm alright with electric solidbody violins. I can't hear any difference. Violinists like them because they are more ergonomic. With a trad violin it's not unusual to cause degeneration of the jaw, leading to surgery. Electric violin you can strap on instead of using jaw pressure. I think the lower position would be more comfortable for the arm too.



I played flute for a while but the position of the arms was too unnatural. I reverted to guitar and keyboard. Sax would be nice but it would be too loud and raucous for the neighbors

 

[Swamp Thing]

Sax would be nice but it would be too loud and raucous for the neighbors

There are lots of digital ones, ranging from cheap Chinese ones to Yamaha ones. There are many digital sax reviews on YouTube, but I picked this one for the title.

 

[DaveE]

For a more 60's/classic rock take, check out It's A Beautiful Day (David LaFlamme, really).
This was their big hit, White Bird:

 

[Swamp Thing]

After posting about digital saxophones that let you practice non-destructively in terms of neighborliness, I was wondering if one could make a mask thing that would let you sing almost silently while monitoring yourself on headphones.

Turns out there is something called a Beltbox that goes some way towards that goal. It seems to be just a passive damper.

Maybe there are products with electronic cancellation and bluetooth connectivity to headphones. Ideally, it would have to present the same impedance to the mouth as unimpeded air, while actively radiating sound that is out of phase with the leakage through the mask. And also send the inside sound to your headphones.

From an Amazon listing:

Decompress and Release Stress - Shout, scream and vent your frustrations out loud with the voice-dampener mask. The scream box is ideal for stress relief and decompression anytime and anywhere.

 

[Hornbein]

Instead of a digital sax I might go for a breath controller and a keyboard. That is, one's breath controls the volume. Then I don't have to learn a new instrument fingering and get about the same result as a digital sax at a lower price, $200 maybe. I've seen a keyboard man get a very nice horn section effect that way. I have used the manual volume control on the keyboard. It's better than nothing but not enough. I think volume control is too hard to do with a foot pedal, as is done with organs. Feet aren't nimble enough.

Breath controllers though tend to be MIDI, which I would rather not get involved in. It would be ideal to have it be a dedicated volume control that I can just plug straight into. I dunno if such a thing exists. They like to use MIDI because then any parameter can be controlled that way. But I bet they are used for volume 99% of the time.

 

[Hornbein]

Getting back on topic. The violinless original was/is a huge hit in China.



Dance is much more popular in eastern Asia than in the modern Western world, where it went out of style in about 1965 and has yet to return.

Here's the original. It is a relatively low budget production from Japan. There is still much enmity between China and Japan but due to the Eighty Year Rule this is coming to an end.

 

[Hornbein]

Here's the original.

 

[berkeman]

Happy Friday!

 

[pinball1970]

Guitar is maybe the easiest

Woah!
Perhaps if you're playing a tune on one string, or strumming Em7sus (all open strings) down strokes only!

 

[Hornbein]

This takes a while to get going.



Japan has such an excess of violinists they are exporting them to European orchestras. Daishin Kashimoto is a concertmaster of the Berlin Philharmonic.