Yes, that looks like a reasonable method to find the range of A(n). Good job!

  • Thread starter Thread starter Saracen Rue
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Window
Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The problem involves a composite function modeling a window frame and a second composite function representing the bounds of a region to be filled with stained glass. The task includes finding constants, expressing areas as functions, and determining domains and ranges, all within the context of specified constraints on the variable n.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning, Problem interpretation, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the determination of the constant a and the expression for the area A(n) as a function of n and b. There is confusion regarding the range of A(n), particularly how to handle the boundaries given the constraints on n. Some participants suggest using graphical techniques to identify maximum and minimum values, while others explore the implications of the logarithmic function in the area expression.

Discussion Status

The discussion is active, with participants sharing their attempts at solving parts of the problem and expressing uncertainty about the range of A(n). Some guidance has been offered regarding the use of graphing software to analyze the area function, and there is an acknowledgment of the complexity of the area formula.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the constraint on n, which is defined as 1 < n ≤ 10, and the requirement to express the domain and range of A(n) to three decimal places. There is also mention of the potential for the minimum area to be zero, which remains unverified.

Saracen Rue
Messages
150
Reaction score
10

Homework Statement


Sally makes a window frame which can be modeled by the composite function ##f\left(x\right)=\left[-8e^{\frac{x}{30}}+160\left\{0\le x\le a\right\},\ -8e^{\frac{-x}{30}}+160\left\{-a\le x<0\right\}\right]##, where ##a## is the x-intercept. A second composite function, ##g\left(x\right)=\left[50\log _n\left(\frac{x}{2}+1\right)\left\{0\le x\le b\right\},50\log _n\left(1-\frac{x}{2}\right)\left\{-b\le x\le 0\right\}\right]## (where ##b## is the x-coordinate of the point of intersection), models the bounds of the region which is to be filled with stained glass as shown:
Area%20math%20question_zps5agqjmaw.png

Given that all units are in centimeters and that ##1<n≤10##;

(a) Find the exact value of the constant, ##a##

(b) Express the area of the region which is to be filled with stained glass as a function of ##n## and in terms of ##b##.

(c) State the domain and range of the ##A(n)##, correct to 3 decimal places

(d) The cost of stained glass is ##$450## per square meter and the cost of regular glass is ##$200## per square meter. If Sally can only spend ##$800##;
i) Find the maximum area of stained glass Sally could use correct to 4 decimal places
ii) Determine the value of ##n## for this area, correct to 1 decimal place.​

Homework Equations


Integrating between two points on a graph gives the area under the graph between said points

The Attempt at a Solution


I was able to do parts (a) and (b) without much trouble, but I'm rather stuck at part (c). I understand that the restriction on ##n## which was given as part of the question acts as the domain of ##A(n)##, but what I don't understand is how exactly the range part works. The lowest possible area occurs at ##n=10## and is inclusive, which is fine. The largest area is confusing me though - I tried making ##n=1## to find the area at the point, and then specifying that that point is not inclusive (which is how I've always done this sort of question). However, when I do this I get not-defined as an answer. Can anybody help please?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
Saracen Rue said:

Homework Statement


Sally makes a window frame which can be modeled by the composite function ##f\left(x\right)=\left[-8e^{\frac{x}{30}}+160\left\{0\le x\le a\right\},\ -8e^{\frac{-x}{30}}+160\left\{-a\le x<0\right\}\right]##, where ##a## is the x-intercept. A second composite function, ##g\left(x\right)=\left[50\log _n\left(\frac{x}{2}+1\right)\left\{0\le x\le b\right\},50\log _n\left(1-\frac{x}{2}\right)\left\{-b\le x\le 0\right\}\right]## (where ##b## is the x-coordinate of the point of intersection), models the bounds of the region which is to be filled with stained glass as shown:
Area%20math%20question_zps5agqjmaw.png

Given that all units are in centimeters and that ##1<n≤10##;

(a) Find the exact value of the constant, ##a##

(b) Express the area of the region which is to be filled with stained glass as a function of ##n## and in terms of ##b##.

(c) State the domain and range of the ##A(n)##, correct to 3 decimal places

(d) The cost of stained glass is ##$450## per square meter and the cost of regular glass is ##$200## per square meter. If Sally can only spend ##$800##;
i) Find the maximum area of stained glass Sally could use correct to 4 decimal places
ii) Determine the value of ##n## for this area, correct to 1 decimal place.​

Homework Equations


Integrating between two points on a graph gives the area under the graph between said points

The Attempt at a Solution


I was able to do parts (a) and (b) without much trouble, but I'm rather stuck at part (c). I understand that the restriction on ##n## which was given as part of the question acts as the domain of ##A(n)##, but what I don't understand is how exactly the range part works. The lowest possible area occurs at ##n=10## and is inclusive, which is fine. The largest area is confusing me though - I tried making ##n=1## to find the area at the point, and then specifying that that point is not inclusive (which is how I've always done this sort of question). However, when I do this I get not-defined as an answer. Can anybody help please?
What do you get for A(n)?
 
Mark44 said:
What do you get for A(n)?
I got ##A(n)=2(∫_0^{b}(50\log _a\left(\frac{x}{2}+1\right))dx + ∫_b^{a}(-8e^{\frac{x}{30}}+160)dx)## where ##a=30ln(20)##

After integrating I got ##A(n)=\frac{20}{\ln \left(n\right)}\left(24\left(\ln \left(n\right)\right)e^{\frac{b}{30}}+5b\ln \left(b+2\right)-16b\ln \left(n\right)+10\ln \left(b+2\right)-5b\ln \left(2\right)-5b+480\ln \left(n\right)\ln \left(5\right)+960\ln \left(n\right)\ln \left(2\right)-480\ln \left(n\right)-10\ln \left(2\right)\right)##
 
Bump
 
Saracen Rue said:
I got ##A(n)=2(∫_0^{b}(50\log _a\left(\frac{x}{2}+1\right))dx + ∫_b^{a}(-8e^{\frac{x}{30}}+160)dx)## where ##a=30ln(20)##

After integrating I got ##A(n)=\frac{20}{\ln \left(n\right)}\left(24\left(\ln \left(n\right)\right)e^{\frac{b}{30}}+5b\ln \left(b+2\right)-16b\ln \left(n\right)+10\ln \left(b+2\right)-5b\ln \left(2\right)-5b+480\ln \left(n\right)\ln \left(5\right)+960\ln \left(n\right)\ln \left(2\right)-480\ln \left(n\right)-10\ln \left(2\right)\right)##
This looks reasonable, but I haven't worked the problem.

For part c, the domain of A(n) seems straightforward, but finding the range isn't. Your formula for area is complicated enough that you will probably need to find the max and min using graphing software. The instruction to get the domain and range correct to three decimal places seems to be a hint that you will need to use graphical techniques rather than analytic techniques.

Some things I would look at:
1) Is A(n) either increasing or decreasing on its domain? (Probably not, though.) If it is increasing, the maximum area would occur at the right end of the domain, and the minimum area would occur at the left end. If it's decreasing, the minimum area would occur at the opposite ends as described above.
2) Plot a graph of A(n) using a graphing calculator or graphing software, and look for high and low points. You could also do this using a spreadsheet for calculations. For the maximum value of A(n), if you narrow the interval you're looking at sufficiently, you should be able to get the maximum value with three decimal place precision. Same strategy for the minimum, although it might be that the minimum area is 0.
 
Mark44 said:
This looks reasonable, but I haven't worked the problem.

For part c, the domain of A(n) seems straightforward, but finding the range isn't. Your formula for area is complicated enough that you will probably need to find the max and min using graphing software. The instruction to get the domain and range correct to three decimal places seems to be a hint that you will need to use graphical techniques rather than analytic techniques.

Some things I would look at:
1) Is A(n) either increasing or decreasing on its domain? (Probably not, though.) If it is increasing, the maximum area would occur at the right end of the domain, and the minimum area would occur at the left end. If it's decreasing, the minimum area would occur at the opposite ends as described above.
2) Plot a graph of A(n) using a graphing calculator or graphing software, and look for high and low points. You could also do this using a spreadsheet for calculations. For the maximum value of A(n), if you narrow the interval you're looking at sufficiently, you should be able to get the maximum value with three decimal place precision. Same strategy for the minimum, although it might be that the minimum area is 0.
Graphing does seem like the easiest way to solve this problem, thank you. However I think I may have worked out another method.

For ##A(n)=\frac{20}{\ln \left(n\right)}\left(24\left(\ln \left(n\right)\right)e^{\frac{b}{30}}+5b\ln \left(b+2\right)-16b\ln \left(n\right)+10\ln \left(b+2\right)-5b\ln \left(2\right)-5b+480\ln \left(n\right)\ln \left(5\right)+960\ln \left(n\right)\ln \left(2\right)-480\ln \left(n\right)-10\ln \left(2\right)\right)##, we can see there is a dilation factor of ##\frac{20}{\ln \left(n\right)}##. As ##log_m(1)=0##, we can conclude that at ##n=1## the dilation factor becomes ##20/0##, which makes the entire function ##A(n)## not defined. So let's look at what happens when ##n→1## instead. As ##n→1##, ##ln(n)→0## and ##\frac{20}{\ln \left(n\right)}→∞##. From this we can predict that the largest possible area is increasing as ##n## approaches ##1##. To confirm this, we can substitute various decreasing values of ##n## into ##g(x)## (such as ##n=5, n=2, n=1.5, n=1.2##) and solve simultaneously with ##f(x)## to find ##b##. By doing this we can see that as ##n→1##, ##b→0##. Looking back at my initial area equation, ##A(n)=2(∫_0^{b}(50\log _n\left(\frac{x}{2}+1\right))dx + ∫_b^{30ln(20)}(-8e^{\frac{x}{30}}+160)dx)##, if we let ##b=0## we get ##A(n)=2(∫_0^{0}(50\log _n\left(\frac{x}{2}+1\right))dx + ∫_0^{30ln(20)}(-8e^{\frac{x}{30}}+160)dx) =2(∫_0^{30ln(20)}(-8e^{\frac{x}{30}}+160)dx) ## Thus we can finally see that as ##n→1##, ##A(n)→∫_{-30ln(20)}^{30ln(20)}f(x)dx##.

Now if we actually answer the question...
##Domain_{A(n)}: (1, 10]##
##Range_{A(n)}: [A(10), 2∫_0^{30ln(20)}(-8e^{\frac{x}{30}}+160)dx) = [9874.198, 19639.030)##

Does this look like it could be right to you?
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
1K
Replies
23
Views
2K
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 14 ·
Replies
14
Views
4K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K
Replies
2
Views
1K
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 0 ·
Replies
0
Views
4K
Replies
32
Views
4K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
3K