U.S. Postal Service on the Verge of Collapse

OmCheeto

It would be interesting to know how much of the following left wing propaganda is true:

Did she say $50 billion in pre-funded retirement?

*DoggerDan*

Quote by edward

It would be interesting to see how it would work out if UPS and Fedex were required to deliver tons of junk mail to rural areas, or anywhere for that matter.

Why would they be "required" to deliver anything? They're private institutions and may very well restrict their services to legitimate mail.

Pengwuino

Quote by edward

It would be interesting to see how it would work out if UPS and Fedex were required to deliver tons of junk mail to rural areas, or anywhere for that matter.

Is this meant to be something profound?

Why not say you wonder if a $80/night hotel would offer 1000 sq ft luxury suites. Of course it wouldn't because it's a stupid idea. All you're pointing out is the USPS does stupid things that no one else is dumb enough to do .

AlephZero

Quote by DoggerDan

Why would they be "required" to deliver anything? They're private institutions and may very well restrict their services to legitimate mail.

They are commerical instutitions. They will deliver anything for a price that means they make a profit from it.

If that price was out of reach of the junk-mail originators, I doubt many of the recipients would complain.

*WhoWee*

Quote by Pengwuino

Is this meant to be something profound?

Why not say you wonder if a $80/night hotel would offer 1000 sq ft luxury suites. Of course it wouldn't because it's a stupid idea. All you're pointing out is the USPS does stupid things that no one else is dumb enough to do .

Please finish the thought - and we (as taxpayers) are forced to pay for their decisions - like the extension of the union agreement ratified in May in spite of losses this year projected to exceed $7Billion.

OmCheeto

Minimum rate for a FedEx letter delivery to a residence: $7.62¹ (add $14.01 for shipments to Alaska & Hawaii)
Minimum regular rate for a USPS letter delivery to a residence: $0.44 (including Alaska & Hawaii)
Minimum junk mail rate for a USPS letter delivery to a residence: $0.139² (not counting the non-profit rate, which starts at $0.067 per piece)

hmmm....

Everyone hates junk mail. No one would want to pay $7.62 to send a letter. 90% of mail in our boxes is junk.

Solution: Raise the junk mail rates.

ref 1: Fedex Rates
ref 2: USPS DMM

Vanadium 50

The junk mail rates already subsidize first class mail. Indeed, UPS and FedEx have tried to get into the junk mail business, only to be told that it's a federal crime for anyone other than the USPS to do it. The problem is that if these rates are raised substantially, advertisers will go elsewhere. You're already seeing it - "opt in to Megacorp's email list, and we'll give you a coupon every week".

edward

The Postal service has had to survive by delivering Junk mail for a number of years now. We all know that.

Just before the economy tanked and the flow of junk mail slowed, the Postal Service was hit with the pre funding mandate for retirees health care.

At the heart of the matter is a 2006 Congressional mandate put on the US Postal Service contained in the “Postal Accountability and Enhancement Act of 2006” to pre-fund health-care benefits of future retirees, a 75 year liability over a 10 year period. No other agency or corporation is required to do this. This provision costs the Postal Service $5.5 billion a year. When you add in an adjustment that was made in how workers’ compensation costs were calculated based on interest rate assumptions and long term predictions concerning health care and compensation of $2.5 billion (a non cash accounting adjustment), you come up with $8 billion in cost.

http://my.firedoglake.com/mmonk/2011...union/#more-42

75 Years??? Apparently they have mandated pre funded health care for people who aren't born yet.

edward

Quote by Pinguino

Is this meant to be something profound?

Why not say you wonder if a $80/night hotel would offer 1000 sq ft luxury suites. Of course it wouldn't because it's a stupid idea. All you're pointing out is the USPS does stupid things that no one else is dumb enough to do .

WOW your sure jumped all over that like white on rice.

I was actually thinking more along the line of something else entirely. The Postal Service delivers mail everywhere from the bottom of the Grand Canyon to the wilds of Alaska where they use snowmobiles.

Are those Fedex trucks going to work out?? Fedex does want to get some of the junk mail in high density areas but there is no way they would touch any area where they can not make a profit even though the Postal Service is required to deliver in those areas.

Advertising junk is a part of life whether in the mail or in a television commercial.

*WhoWee*

Quote by edward

WOW your sure jumped all over that like white on rice.

I was actually thinking more along the line of something else entirely. The Postal Service delivers mail everywhere from the bottom of the Grand Canyon to the wilds of Alaska where they use snowmobiles.

Are those Fedex trucks going to work out?? Fedex does want to get some of the junk mail in high density areas but there is no way they would touch any area where they can not make a profit even though the Postal Service is required to deliver in those areas.

Advertising junk is a part of life whether in the mail or in a television commercial.

On the other hand, does junk really need to be delivered on a daily basis and separately (versus a weekly/bi-weekly or monthly junk bundle)?

edward

Quote by WhoWee

On the other hand, does junk really need to be delivered on a daily basis and separately (versus a weekly/bi-weekly or monthly junk bundle)?

Good point, although I would imagine that the originators of the junk mail would want some kind of timely delivery.

Pengwuino

Quote by Vanadium 50

The junk mail rates already subsidize first class mail. Indeed, UPS and FedEx have tried to get into the junk mail business, only to be told that it's a federal crime for anyone other than the USPS to do it. The problem is that if these rates are raised substantially, advertisers will go elsewhere. You're already seeing it - "opt in to Megacorp's email list, and we'll give you a coupon every week".

I don't understand how junk mail works in the slightest. What is considered "junk-mail" and if it's the cheapest type of mail, how can it really subsidize anything? I would expect the opposite to happen, the more expensive mails subsidizing cheaper ones.

I'm trying to think of what kind of junk mail is actually half decent... but I'm having problems with that.

Vanadium 50

Quote by Pengwuino

I don't understand how junk mail works in the slightest. What is considered "junk-mail" and if it's the cheapest type of mail, how can it really subsidize anything? I would expect the opposite to happen, the more expensive mails subsidizing cheaper ones.

The price doesn't matter. What matters is the difference between what you charge and what it costs. Junk mail has a low price, but an even lower cost. It comes directly to the local Post Office, and doesn't have to be sorted: just delivered, one per house. (This is why they don't allow opt-out of junk mail) It goes straight on the truck, which was making the route anyway. So the incremental cost is close to zero - it's pure profit.

Pengwuino

Quote by Vanadium 50

The price doesn't matter. What matters is the difference between what you charge and what it costs. Junk mail has a low price, but an even lower cost. It comes directly to the local Post Office, and doesn't have to be sorted: just delivered, one per house. (This is why they don't allow opt-out of junk mail) It goes straight on the truck, which was making the route anyway. So the incremental cost is close to zero - it's pure profit.

Thanks! Like any good forum member, I realized I should just wiki it after I had already made the post.

So what about mailings from credit card companies? They seem to always have my name/address on it but I assume those can be given to USPS in one massive distribution, but it seems like that would still need to be sorted by address on the delivery end.

Vanadium 50

Quote by WhoWee

On the other hand, does junk really need to be delivered on a daily basis and separately (versus a weekly/bi-weekly or monthly junk bundle)?

Let me say this again. This will not help. Under the present UPWA contract, the Post Office cannot cut staff, except by attrition. Finding less and less for the USPS to do won't save any money, because you still need to pay the staff.

This can't be solved on the expenses side - it has to be attacked from the revenue side. Perhaps an individual mandate, where each citizen is legally obligated to send a certain amount of mail?

Pengwuino

Quote by Vanadium 50

Let me say this again. This will not help. Under the present UPWA contract, the Post Office cannot cut staff, except by attrition. Finding less and less for the USPS to do won't save any money, because you still need to pay the staff.

This can't be solved on the expenses side - it has to be attacked from the revenue side. Perhaps an individual mandate, where each citizen is legally obligated to send a certain amount of mail?

take that internet!

How in the world did the USPS get into such a horrid contract?

mheslep

If the USPS is overstaffed, and the staff can not be cut under current contract, might it be possible to assign postal employees to other tasks, outside of normal mail handling, where labor is short and they could be useful in reducing net government expenses?

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OmCheeto Recognitions: Gold Member	U.S. Postal Service on the Verge of Collapse It would be interesting to know how much of the following left wing propaganda is true: Did she say $50 billion in pre-funded retirement?

mheslep Recognitions: Gold Member	If the USPS is overstaffed, and the staff can not be cut under current contract, might it be possible to assign postal employees to other tasks, outside of normal mail handling, where labor is short and they could be useful in reducing net government expenses?