Checking for negative feedback in a circuit

In summary, the conversation is discussing the function of an inverting summing amplifier and how it adds multiple voltages together. The main question is how the voltage at the inverting input terminal, v-, increases when the output voltage, v_out, also increases. The conversation also touches on the concept of voltage dividers and circuit equations.
  • #1
Milotic
5
0
Screen Shot 2021-04-11 at 6.25.11 PM.png

This is the circuit in question.
During lecture, when checking whether this was negative feedback, my instructor said that if the v_out increases, then v- increases as well, which would lead to the next v_out decreasing because v_out = A(v+ - v-). I get how if v- increases the next v_out would decrease and that'd give a negative feedback, but the problem is, I don't understand how v_out increasing (initially) also leads to the v- increasing.

Actually, there was a similar question we went over just before:
Screen Shot 2021-04-11 at 6.32.35 PM.png

Here, my instructor said the same thing; if the v_out increased, then v- also increases, leading to smaller v_out the next time. Here, I thought I understood why: there's a voltage divider from V_s to v_out, where (v- - v_out) = R2 * V_s /(R1+R2). Since none of the resistances nor the voltage source V_s change, if v_out increases, v- would have to increase as well, or that was my understanding. (Is my understanding right?)

However, going back to the circuit for Inverting Summing Amplifier, we don't exactly have a voltage divider, do we? Because the two voltage sources V1 and V2 are in parallel, I don't see how I could combine them (I think you can only combine voltage sources in series). So assuming I'm right in not seeing any voltage dividers in Inverting Summing Amplifier, what makes v- go up as v_out goes up?
 
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  • #2
Milotic said:
However, going back to the circuit for Inverting Summing Amplifier, we don't exactly have a voltage divider, do we? Because the two voltage sources V1 and V2 are in parallel, I don't see how I could combine them (I think you can only combine voltage sources in series). So assuming I'm right in not seeing any voltage dividers in Inverting Summing Amplifier, what makes v- go up as v_out goes up?

Since it is an inverting summing amplifier, its function is of course to add all the voltages connected to its inverting input terminal through the corresponding resistor, and then perform inverting amplification. Is it not obvious from the wiring diagram?

Next, I think you can try to derive the circuit equation.
 
  • #3
@alan123hk well, I must say sometimes I have trouble understanding wiring diagrams right, but after reading your comment I drew things out again this is what I interpreted the inverting summing amplifier's (partial) circuit to be—is this correct? Since V1 and V2 seem to be kind of in series maybe I could add those two voltage sources(?) to have some form of voltage divider, I guess, but I also have the v_out in parallel with V2, which makes me doubt that.
invert.jpeg


what I thought initially was this below:
inverter2.jpeg


also, what do you mean by circuit equation?
 
Last edited:
  • #4
Milotic said:
I must say sometimes I have trouble understanding wiring diagrams right, but after reading your comment I drew things out again this is what I interpreted the inverting summing amplifier's (partial) circuit to be—is this correct? Since V1 and V2 seem to be kind of in series maybe I could add those two voltage sources(?) to have some form of voltage divider, I guess, but I also have the v_out in parallel with V2, which makes me doubt that.

Ignore the op amp first. Please see the picture below.

Add1.jpg


If V1 is now increased, and V2 and V3 remain unchanged, of course V4 will increase. I believe you should agree with this. Now we increase V2 and V3 sequentially, and the other two voltages remain unchanged, which will cause V4 to increase sequentially as V2 and V3 increase. So, isn't this a simple resistor circuit that adds these three voltages together?
 

What is negative feedback in a circuit?

Negative feedback in a circuit is a process where a portion of the output signal is fed back to the input of the circuit in order to reduce or stabilize the overall output. This helps to maintain a steady state and prevent the circuit from becoming unstable.

Why is it important to check for negative feedback in a circuit?

Checking for negative feedback in a circuit is important because it helps to ensure the stability and reliability of the circuit. Without proper negative feedback, the circuit may become unstable and produce unpredictable results. Additionally, negative feedback can be used to control the gain and frequency response of the circuit.

How can negative feedback be identified in a circuit?

Negative feedback can be identified in a circuit by measuring the output and input signals and comparing them. If the output signal is reduced or stabilized compared to the input signal, then negative feedback is present in the circuit. Additionally, negative feedback can be identified by analyzing the circuit's transfer function.

What are some common methods for checking negative feedback in a circuit?

Some common methods for checking negative feedback in a circuit include using an oscilloscope to measure the output and input signals, using a multimeter to measure the voltage and current in the circuit, and performing a frequency response analysis to determine the circuit's gain and stability.

How can negative feedback be adjusted or controlled in a circuit?

Negative feedback in a circuit can be adjusted or controlled by changing the values of the feedback components, such as resistors or capacitors. This can be done manually or through a feedback control system. Additionally, the placement and type of feedback in the circuit can also be adjusted to achieve the desired level of stability and control.

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