Is It Valid to Cancel Sets in Set Theory?

In summary, the conversation discusses the proof that A-B = A-(A∩B) is only possible when A and B are the same set. The conversation also touches on the topic of performing algebraic operations on sets and their cardinalities, and concludes that such operations are not always valid.
  • #1
parshyaa
307
19
We can prove that
When A and B are two sets(A≠B)
(A-B) = (A∩B') = (A-(A∩B))
{We can also confirm them using venn diagram}
From first and third relation
A-B = A - (A∩B)
By cancelling A from both side
I get B = (A∩B)
Which is only possible when A and B are same set.
What is wrong in my proof , is it not valid to cancell sets A from both side(if yes then why?)
 
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  • #2
parshyaa said:
By cancelling A from both side
There is no such operation.
 
  • #3
mfb said:
There is no such operation.
So we can not cancell sets
mfb said:
There is no such operation.
Can you give a reason for not to cancell sets from both side( or another similar example)
Another question:
what does addition of two sets means
I know what does (A∪B) ,(A-B) meant
But can you tell me what does A + B means
A,B,C are sets
 
  • #4
A-B = A-C does not imply B=C.
Similarly, A∪B = A∪C does not imply B=C either.
parshyaa said:
But can you tell me what does A + B means
From the context, probably the union, (A∪B). If in doubt, ask the person who wrote that.
 
  • #5
mfb said:
A-B = A-C does not imply B=C.
Similarly, A∪B = A∪C does not imply B=C either.From the context, probably the union, (A∪B). If in doubt, ask the person who wrote that.
Ok, A∪B And A+B are same
And n(A∪B)= n(A)+ n(B) -n(A∩B)
Is just for cardinality of (A∪B)

in my first question
You are trying to say that, we can not apply operations on sets we can only apply operations to their cardinality(your example completely proved the reason why, thanks)

A-B = A-(A∩B)
A-A = B-(A∩B)
Φ+(A∩B) = B
Does it implyes any thing?
 
  • #6
mfb said:
A-B = A-C does not imply B=C.
I got a example
A={1,2,3,4}
B={2,3,7,8,9}
C={2,3,7,8,11,13}
A-B = A-C = {1,4}
Clearly we can see B≠C
 
  • #7
parshyaa said:
A-A = B-(A∩B)
That is not correct.
parshyaa said:
Φ+(A∩B) = B
What is Φ? The empty set? That equation is not correct either.

You can see all this by drawing diagrams.
parshyaa said:
I got a example
A={1,2,3,4}
B={2,3,7,8,9}
C={2,3,7,8,11,13}
A-B = A-C = {1,4}
Clearly we can see B≠C
Right. A shorter example:
A={1}, B={2}, C={3}
 
  • #8
mfb said:
That is not correct.What is Φ? The empty set? That equation is not correct either.
I.e what i am saying ,what i have learn from our conversation and from theory is that we can not apply every algebraic operations on set but we can apply them on cardinality of them.
 
  • #9
Cardinalities of finite sets are just integers, and you can add and subtract integers as usual.
 
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  • #10
parshyaa said:
I.e what i am saying ,what i have learn from our conversation and from theory is that we can not apply every algebraic operations on set but we can apply them on cardinality of them.
Sets do not form an algebraic group when defining "addition" as taking the union. You are correct that we cannot perform algebra on them.

However, it is not clear that cardinalities work either.

A = {1}
B = {2}
A-B = {1}
|A| - |B| is not equal to |A-B|
 
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  • #11
jbriggs444 said:
Sets do not form an algebraic group when defining "addition" as taking the union. You are correct that we cannot perform algebra on them.

However, it is not clear that cardinalities work either.

A = {1}
B = {2}
A-B = {1}
|A| - |B| is not equal to |A-B|
Yes,algebraic operations do not work with the cardinality of sets , i just write it because i can write n(A∪B) = n(A) + n(B) - n(A∩B)
But i can't write A = B+(C - D)
 
  • #12
In general, you are trying too many things with sets that are not valid. You should take a step back, pay strict attention to the operations that are defined for sets, and only use the basic operations and things proven from the basic operations. Otherwise, it is tempting to adopt bad habits.
 
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Related to Is It Valid to Cancel Sets in Set Theory?

1) What is a set in set theory?

A set in set theory is a collection of distinct objects, called elements, that are grouped together based on a common characteristic or property. These elements can be anything, such as numbers, letters, or even other sets.

2) What is the cardinality of a set?

The cardinality of a set is the number of elements in the set. It is denoted by the symbol |S|, where S is the set. For example, if a set contains the numbers 2, 4, and 6, its cardinality would be 3.

3) What is the difference between a subset and a proper subset?

A subset of a set A is a set that contains some or all of the elements of A. A proper subset of A is a subset that does not contain all of the elements of A. In other words, a proper subset is a subset that is not equal to the original set.

4) What is the intersection of two sets?

The intersection of two sets A and B is the set of elements that are common to both A and B. It is denoted by A ∩ B. For example, if set A contains the numbers 1, 2, and 3, and set B contains the numbers 2, 3, and 4, then the intersection of A and B would be the set {2, 3}.

5) How is set theory used in other fields of study?

Set theory is a fundamental concept in mathematics and is used in various fields such as computer science, physics, and statistics. In computer science, sets are used to represent data structures and to solve problems. In physics, sets are used to describe groups of particles or states of a system. In statistics, sets are used to represent and manipulate data for analysis.

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