Japan Earthquake: Nuclear Plants at Fukushima Daiichi

[zapperzero]

Hummm... that's new to me (and maybe others?). Wasn't aware that they were planning a venting operation also at Unit 1 on Daini site. It seems that as we were fully concentrated with some reason on th Daichi plant, the way to "cold stop" at Daini N°1 was not so straight and smooth as we heard about (but Tepco at least reported it, we just didn't hear about it).

Yes, touch and go there for a while, but it was all buried in the sound and fury of Dai-ichi. I was following this with only half an eye, myself, and it sprang into focus only when I saw the announcement that made me start the discussion.

TEPCO must be very happy the media didn't make a fuss about this, because Daini was not significantly affected by the tsunami, only by the earthquake. The tsunami may have been beyond design basis, but the earthquake wasn't.

It follows that the plant was perhaps wrongly designed (GE would be on the hook here) and/or wrongly built (Hitachi, Toshiba, a myriad subcontractors) and/or badly maintained (TEPCO). Given TEPCO's operational record, I think I know whodunnit.

 

[maddog1964]

I am not a chemist, but have been comparing equipment locations from the #1 blueprint (assuming all buildings have a similar layout...)

in regards to the north side wall.. the water cleaning/balancing systems seem to be in that area.

final grade elev @10000 Reactor Invert @ 15200 Hydralic syst @ 10200

NORTH SIDE OF BLD (BASED ON ASSUMED DRAWING - ALL I HAVE)

Filter sludge reciver Equipt# 1207-10 elev @ 18700 (OP floor base)
Filter sludge pump Equipt# 1207-9 elev @ 18700

Non-regerative heat ex Equipt# 1204 cl of tank elv @ 22620
Regerative heat exch's Equipt#'s 1203 cl of tank elv @ 21120 (2)
Regerative heat exch's Equip#'s 1203 cl of tank elv @ 16620 (2)

Clean up Flow system Equipt# 2254 (shown in pipe way) @ elv 18700

Pre-coat tank Equipt# 1207-7 elv @25900 (OP floor elv)
Pre-coat Cooler Equpit# 1207-12 elv @ 25900
Pre-coat Pump Equipt# 1207-11 elv @25900

Clean up Flow system Equipt# 2254 (in pipe way at elv. 18700)

Its my understanding that this equipment is all/or in part pertains to maintaing and balancing of SPF and (possibly) reactor water... from what i have found the systems extract Radiation and other elements, in which my guess would be that the "sludge reciver system" would be the collection point of the particles extraced..
It is a Complex system still breaking out the functions of all the equipment and the equipment not shown on drawing...
while working on the systems have read the the "sludge" will retain Radioactive material and "fostered by the warmth and Energy" can create chemical reations that procduce Hydrogen gas and Nitrous Oxide... very explosive and Flammable combination.. must be vented to prevent explosive astmosp.."

I (like i said am not and engineer nor chemist... have just started to look into the cleaning system... did read that (TEPCO) said it maintains the SPF chemistry and removes various items, etc... (This I do need to recheck... some of the sites have disapeard)

In conclusion, there seems to be many items that MAY have had a contributing factor in the way the buildings exploded and would welcome any feed back on the subject... excepcialy the "chemistry" on the residules left in tanks and the sludge recivers.

edit: also the equipment number seem to tie together with and expected pattern

 

[imandylite]

Latest Packbot video of unit 1.

Video taken 29 April 2011

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BL1kcB1ClBk"

 

[|Fred]

Oh. All better now, yes?

I'm fine thank you, that being said I do not see why you are stating that Tepco Lied about Daini being in shut down.Moreover the paper does not suggest that the cooling system was repaired in April.

 

[jlduh]

From new data from SPEEDI released today, it seems that part (or maybe most?) of the plume of higher contamination which went towards the areas North West side of the plant would correspond to the explosion of N°2 reactor:

http://www3.nhk.or.jp/daily/english/03_20.html

The data for 10 p.m. on March 15th, when an explosion occurred at the No.2 reactor, shows radiation flowing out of the screen to the northeast.

Such data had been withheld for fear of causing panic.

Goshi Hosono, secretary general of the joint task force set up by the government and the Tokyo Electric Power Company, apologized on Monday for the delay in releasing the data.

After the fact, i really think that japanese have so far been very lucky to have the winds mainly blowing at critical times in the "good direction", ie towards pacific ocean... Except for N°2 reactor though.

 

[|Fred]

and either I am missing something, or there is no differences between all three. WNN and TEPCO pages both state that reactors were shut down on March 15th, Reuters states
which probably means that the systems were repaired several weeks ago and the plant was kept in cold shutdown state since. Or is my English failing me and Reuters text means cooling system was repaired just now?

I think that's the issue here .. I do to read that the paper says "(repaired cooling and shutdown) for several weeks", and alternate reading is "just repair cooling , shutdown for several weeks.

 

[Krikkosnack]

I believe that some managers and mentors of this thread, should begin to sum ​​up somewhere ( https://www.physicsforums.com/showpost.php?p=3185466&postcount=46" ), I don't know maybe at the beginning, what we now know about the situation of Fukushima, otherwise every person enters an avalanche of repetitive information.

Now I ask you have a list of answers and certain assumptions that we have arrived? After 5000 + post what we really know? What we are confident? I still have major concerns.
I do not know if it helps but maybe someone could create a schema such as paragraphs. For example

1) Charts
1.1 of buildings -> Link to post # 1 Link # 2 Link # 3
Reactor 1.2 1.0 -> Link to post # 1 Link # 2 Link # 3
2) site map 1.0 -> Link4, Link5, Link6
3) interesting pictures -> Link7, Link8, Link9
4) measures levels of radioactivity -> Link10, Link11, Link12
5) latest statements TEPCO -> Link13, Link14, Link15
6) Video
6.1 explosion -> Link to post # 1 Link # 2 Link # 3
6.2 T-Hawk
6.3 Radioactivity measurements
7) Clear responses
8) Questions still unanswered
9) timeline events

 

[MadderDoc]

Well, it's an interesting picture. Where is it from? Do you have any more of this about the rest of the U3? What I have has much lesser quality.

Try
http://www.fukushima.net.au/index.php?page=photos&PHPSESSID=b977ba8f5624ed259d9ec79e017ccba1

What I see on that pic: there are at least two main release paths clearly visible, but the main beams through the pats looks more corroded than burnt, however the smaller (Al?) pieces looks melted, or at least softened.

Yeah, and the corrosion is rusty, the material is not Al. The photo is from March 24th, steam had been gushing out there for many days, so the corrosion is no wonder. this must have been one of the first days one could see this portion of the roof clearly for steam.

The positions of the release paths are consistent with the thermal images where some hot spots could be identified around the supposed position of reactor well.

Indeed. However, on days when it steams it is the temperature of the steam the thermal camera is seeing, certainly not whatever hot stuff is down there under.

Curiously on the thermal images the greenish area on the photo to the south of the burnt area, is what shows up as being the hottest spot on the roof. However when it steams from the roof, the steam is coming from this burnt area closer to the reactor. I've not yet seen a photo in which the steam appeared to be coming distinctly from the SFP.

But the image also implies that the remains of the roof structure had to be there, on the top of the heap when this release happened: so at least the west pillars had to be gone at that point (the main destruction pre-dates the release).

I hear you, but I don't think one can conclude that. This would be assuming that the fire phenomena during the blast was confined to the lowest few meters above the service deck. It is obvious from the videos of the explosion that that was not the case. You find heat damage also on the more elevated parts of the fallen roof structure. Indeed, there is a lucky frame from one of the earliest helicopter flyovers, which appears to show heat damage to one of the uppermost concrete pillars on the east face of the building.

Also, the release had to be more corrosive than hot - hydrogen flame would cut through those beams within seconds. Steam? HOT steam?

But, you are not taking account of the time perspective. This is _not_ how the roof looked right after the explosion. Since then there has been 10 days of incessant steam gushing out there, and 1000s of m³ of water has been sprayed to the top of the building, no wonder the burnt parts are rusty.

About the FHM I've spotted something but it'll take some time to present it.

Gosh what a cliff-hanger. :-)

 

[Borek]

I believe that some managers and mentors of this thread, should begin to sum ​​up somewhere

Feel free to try to do so. This is a time consuming task and we already moderate in our free time, we are not a paid staff.

I am not complaining, I love the site But I don't have enough free time for such a task. Same about Astronuc.

 

[rowmag]

The evacuation zones were decided based on similar plots, but not sure whether exactly these ones. These plots show the estimated exposures received so far, and the evacuation zones were, I believe, based on projections of exposures expected over the next year. (Not sure how those were calculated, whether they extrapolated from present estimated ground contamination patterns, or whether they did something fancier, such as using SPEEDI with typical wind patterns over the course of a typical year, and some assumption about ongoing emissions...)

Anyway, there have been several such maps shown, and they all have the general features of one big pseudopod going up to the North-West, and a smaller one down to the South-West, but they differ in various details after that. The people living in the northwest pseudopod (beyond the circular zone that is already under evacuation orders), in the towns of Iitatemura and surrounding areas, have been told to evacuate by the end of this month. The people in the southwest pseudopod (in the town of Iwaki) have not, if I recall correctly.

I don't think any orders to take potassium iodide have been issued, by the way, just evacuation orders.

the evacuation orders, in case we already forgot the history, were initially 20km circle, and 30km stay indoors, and remained as that for a long long while.
It really is amazing how quickly history can be altered.

Altering history?? What on Earth are you talking about? Yes, the evacuation zone has grown and evolved in shape (and strictness) over time -- do you get a contrary claim from my post, somehow?

 

[MadderDoc]

Well the difference between before and after is very surprising indeed... but i really doubt that the plant, but also for example the area where all the cooling water from the plant is released into the sea, could have lowered so much in comparison with the viewpoint of the webcam, this is huge difference!

I would imagine more a scenario where the webcam has moved down because of the quake (see the change is between the 14h00 and the 15h00 image).

Well, whether one can believe it or not, this striking change in the spatial arrangement of the webcam, the tree line and the NPP is what the webcam indicates did in fact occur. Naturally the hourly webcam shows the change occurring between 14h00 and 15h00, the earthquake happened at 14h46.

 

[Rive]

Yeah, and the corrosion is rusty, the material is not Al.

Beware, there are two kind of material there: beams and metal strips. IMHO the strips are Al - at least there is no (red) rust on them.

I've not yet seen a photo in which the steam appeared to be coming distinctly from the SFP.

Neither I.

I hear you, but I don't think one can conclude that. This would be assuming that the fire phenomena during the blast was confined to the lowest few meters above the service deck.

I see no evidence that this heat-damage what we are talking about is in connection with the fire/blast. Actually, I think there is no direct connection between them and the fire part were first (with result like U4 or U1) and the heat corrosion/whatever was the very last.

Those release paths looks really localized for me, so I think the beams of the roof were in their actual place when those releases happened. Otherwise the traces on the beams would be on less logical, random places, without such clean contour.

 

[jlduh]

Well, i don't know what was Dmytry meaning in his post but from my standpoint, I've had the impression that the 20kms/30kms zone has been very quickly drawn on the map and that after that, the communication seem to have been very confusing between orders given (evacuate in the 20kms/stay inside for 20 kms/30 kms which is, let it recognize, adapted for a short time but not for more than a month!) and some data released which gradually showed that these orders where sowewhat inappropriated for some areas (like the North west Litate zone for example). The "evacuate voluntarily advice" (20k/30k) was quite surprising also. Then they moved to a new recent position adding some specific zones outside of the circles but it required a "fair amount" of time, as if they were "sticking" very long to their first circles, drawn very quickly (at a time US forces were talking about a 80 kms zone by the way).

I understand that evacuation is not easy, and that's also part of the dangers related to that kind of accident: it can add or remove a lot of effects on people depending if it is done in an efficient way or not. But as i said more than a month ago, infos and decisions have to be consistent otherwise people get lost, and a lot got lost effectively (remember these people going back because they didn't feel that there was a danger as announcements done were always very "soft" (no risk, no danger, don't be overly concerned, and so on). It's certainly good to avoid panic, but on the other side, if communication is so soft and inconsistent that some people think "that's a big deal about nothing, i go back there" -which happened- then that's also a problem in my opinion! Panic is not only "rushing all in the same direction", it can also be create a situation where people don't know what to do in their everyday life ("ok i stay inside but after one week, two weeks, 3 weeks what do i do"...) and go in various contradictory directions because what they perceive is contradictory...

Ok, I'm not "in their shoes" like Borek would say, but now that they released some data confirming more or less what also the US group of experts measured (with airplane screening) very quickly after the accidents, one can even ask if decisions were appropriate in a timely manner, based on the infos that were already available for some time. And if the answer is no (time will tell if it is, I'm just wondering), then why was it inappropriate: because they didn't know, or because they knew and didn't decide to update quickly their decisions, or because they were willing to do it but couldn't do it because of operational and logistics standpoints (which can be understood, or maybe not, in case of poor management on the ground... i don't know, these are question that will be raised with time).

Maybe tat what Dmytry wants to focus upon?

 

[zapperzero]

I think that's the issue here .. I do to read that the paper says "(repaired cooling and shutdown) for several weeks", and alternate reading is "just repair cooling , shutdown for several weeks.

I have a feeling that English is not your first language, and it certainly isn't mine. Some misunderstanding and cultural friction is bound to happen. Please excuse me if I offended you and rest assured that I did not intend to do so.

As I understand that piece of news, the "milestone" they are talking about is "just repaired cooling", indeed. Which means it was damaged before.

 

[zapperzero]

Reuters text means cooling system was repaired just now?

What else would the milestone be? Just the passing of time?

 

[MadderDoc]

I dunno. The problem with this pixel-hunting is that anything can be something else too.

In this case, the big green thing you are highlighting is with little doubt
this grand machine, photographed in its apparently normal sleeping position, west of the equipment pool of unit 3:
gyldengrisgaard.dk/daiichigrab/unit3/f1-21.JPG

This machine, I've been told, is for tightening the head bolts of the reactor in a uniform manner. Talk about special tools. Some spanner, eh? :-)

PS. This machine appears to be the least damaged bit on the deck of unit 3. It doesn't even appear to have been moved much about.

 

[Dmytry]

Well, i don't know what was Dmytry meaning in his post but from my standpoint, I've had the impression that the 20kms/30kms zone has been very quickly drawn on the map and that after that, the communication seem to have been very confusing between orders given (evacuate in the 20kms/stay inside for 20 kms/30 kms which is, let it recognize, adapted for a short time but not for more than a month!) and some data released which gradually showed that these orders where sowewhat inappropriated for some areas (like the North west Litate zone for example). The "evacuate voluntarily advice" (20k/30k) was quite surprising also. Then they moved to a new recent position adding some specific zones outside of the circles but it required a "fair amount" of time, as if they were "sticking" very long to their first circles, drawn very quickly (at a time US forces were talking about a 80 kms zone by the way).

I understand that evacuation is not easy, and that's also part of the dangers related to that kind of accident: it can add or remove a lot of effects on people depending if it is done in an efficient way or not. But as i said more than a month ago, infos and decisions have to be consistent otherwise people get lost, and a lot got lost effectively (remember these people going back because they didn't feel that there was a danger as announcements done were always very "soft" (no risk, no danger, don't be overly concerned, and so on). It's certainly good to avoid panic, but on the other side, if communication is so soft and inconsistent that some people think "that's a big deal about nothing, i go back there" -which happened- then that's also a problem in my opinion! Panic is not only "rushing all in the same direction", it can also be create a situation where people don't know what to do in their everyday life ("ok i stay inside but after one week, two weeks, 3 weeks what do i do"...) and go in various contradictory directions because what they perceive is contradictory...

Well, the rowmag said "The evacuation zones were decided based on similar plots,". Reality check: the evacuation zones were circles. It took over a month until evacuation orders became non circular. A month of REMAIN INDOORS orders for god's sake! Do you guys have a slightest idea what a remain indoors instruction does to people after a month? Especially to old and disabled. Note that it was 20..30 km remain indoors ('voluntarily evacuate'), and 20 km evacuate. Note that this is actually larger area under remain indoors order than was evacuated.
I guess you guys are going to think that they were circles such that radiation can't get out of the circle, but that's not how meteorology works period.

rowmag really is example of the reason why government feels free to keep secrecy... a citizen who, in absence of data, would come up with his own explanations along the lines of how correct the government actions were. That is very convenient. Simple lack of specific data becomes effective positive propaganda in such cases.

I'm really surprised there wasn't widespread panic. Everything was done to incite as much panic as they possibly could. Complete with mis-measurements then release of 'corrected' figures an order of magnitude smaller. Complete with 'remain indoors, there's radiation outside'. Pushing the fear of unknown button as hard as possible. Pushing the uncertainty button as hard as possible, too. Really, what they could have possibly done to cause more panic? Release data honestly, with the plume? That'd be a very reassuring thing, to see that this stuff is being calculated. For people outside plume it'd be directly reassuring, the people inside could have been evacuated instead of hanging in uncertainty and 'remaining indoors'.
Sigh. I'd hate to agree with pro nuclear stupid arguments, but this remain indoors order and 'voluntary evacuation' thing could of easily killed more people than radiation did.

 

[SteveElbows]

In this case, the big green thing you are highlighting is with little doubt
this grand machine, photographed in its apparently normal sleeping position, west of the equipment pool of unit 3:
gyldengrisgaard.dk/daiichigrab/unit3/f1-21.JPG

This machine, I've been told, is for tightening the head bolts of the reactor in a uniform manner. Talk about special tools. Some spanner, eh? :-)

PS. This machine appears to be the least damaged bit on the deck of unit 3. It doesn't even appear to have been moved much about.

Certainly this machine was noticed by someone on forums in the past and commented on. If memory serves me correctly I think they thought it was the fuel bridge, with a theory that it had gone way up in the air and landed on the other side of the building. Personally I did not buy into that theory, but it is also impossible for me to conclude with 100% certainty that this image shows the bolt tightening equipment rather than the fuel bridge. Both are green, and there is nothing in that video that tells me I am looking at a device which is approximately round in shape.

I think that piece of equipment may also be visible on one of the reactor 4 videos, possibly at an angle due to some floor collapse, I will go and have another look and see, it could easily be something else.

Personally I've been more interesting by the old army helicopter video that appears to show large quantities of steam or smoke coming out of what looks to be the removable concrete walls that sit between the dryer separator pit and the reactor cavity. But really what I have learned from looking at a variety of videos and pictures is not very much, and does not justify the time I've spent on it.

 

[SteveElbows]

What is ? I would appreciate If you could refrain to make free comments like this, If you are suggesting that evacuation procedure were not done properly according to the data at hand, I'll welcome your analysis. But if it's just free bashing It's just value less I.M.O.

From what I've looked at I see a real potential concern as far as Iodine children's thyroid protection is concerned. As the accumulated dose exeded 100mSv in zone outside the evac as early as the 24/Mars

Hence my question , about order given to the population. For the rest a first approach to the document seems to indicate that evacuation was made rather appropriately..
But heck I can't check everything.

There is no way the evacuation was handled appropriately, and I am quite surprised that anybody thinks it was. Specifically, the government were negligent in how they handled the regions slightly outside the evacuation zone to the north west. I will have to try to go back and retrace the exact sequence of events to give a completely accurate picture, but I am sure that data was made available showing that parts of the north west really should be evacuated, and this data was available for quite some time before the Japanese government announced that they would eventually make people evacuate those areas. I will go and try to find more detail now.

 

[Rive]

Certainly this machine was noticed by someone on forums in the past and commented on.
...
Both are green, and there is nothing in that video that tells me I am looking at a device which is approximately round in shape.

-
- check the attachment of this post - within the limits of our sources MadderDoc can be right about that 'spanner' :-)

But if this 'spanner' is in place then the much heavier FHM should be there somewhere too.

 

[triumph61]

Is it right that the last day 27.4. Tepco spray Water at Unit 4 ?
I found no more Press release.

 

[WhoWee]

Well, the rowmag said "The evacuation zones were decided based on similar plots,". Reality check: the evacuation zones were circles. It took over a month until evacuation orders became non circular. A month of REMAIN INDOORS orders for god's sake! Do you guys have a slightest idea what a remain indoors instruction does to people after a month? Especially to old and disabled. Note that it was 20..30 km remain indoors ('voluntarily evacuate'), and 20 km evacuate. Note that this is actually larger area under remain indoors order than was evacuated.

It's hard to imagine what these people are going through.

 

[ascot317]

A month of REMAIN INDOORS orders for god's sake! Do you guys have a slightest idea what a remain indoors instruction does to people after a month? Especially to old and disabled.

I haven't been in the area, but in other rural areas of Japan, some people still live in houses that aren't exactly tight. Lots of air moving in and out through bad windows and improper insulation. So, wind can easily contaminate an old house. And even if you're in a tight, modern house, keeping windows closed for a month and turning off AC doesn't really work.

It's really tough to "stay indoors" for a long period of time. They had informations on TV on what to do when you have to get out, e.g. wear a jacket, hat and tight shoes, take them off outside before getting into your house(they do that anyway with their shoes), rinse. Combined with the omnipresent medical face masks this might sound alright, therefore keeping people calm.
But without proper measuring equipment it's impossible to determine whether or not you carry particles on your body, which then just might enter your "safe zone".

I wonder if they have "difficult" data on Tokyo. The time following the explosion of #3 and #4 sometimes had south-bound wind.

Evacuating Tokyo is impossible, so they probably wouldn't tell anyone.

I'm really surprised there wasn't widespread panic.

Japanese "panic" on a different level, I believe. They're generally much more calm than most other people I know.

 

[Jorge Stolfi]

I am not a chemist, but have been comparing equipment locations from the #1 blueprint (assuming all buildings have a similar layout...)

Unfotunately, reactor #1 is quite different from the others. We have some sketchy blueprints of #3's concrete srtucture, without the machinery:

http://www.ic.unicamp.br/~stolfi/EXPORT/projects/fukushima/povray/blueprint/good/

Reactors #2--#4 are said to have the same basic plan. What we can see through the holes on #3 and #4 seems to agree with the above blueprints. However there may be differences. The entrance on the ground floor, for example, looks different between #3 and #4.

 

[Dmytry]

It's hard to imagine what these people are going through.

Precisely. Hard to imagine, easy to understate.

It's really tough to "stay indoors" for a long period of time. They had informations on TV on what to do when you have to get out, e.g. wear a jacket, hat and tight shoes, take them off outside before getting into your house(they do that anyway with their shoes), rinse. Combined with the omnipresent medical face masks this might sound alright, therefore keeping people calm.

I don't think it makes anyone calm to have them go through various steps to avoid a hazard they can't see and can't measure and hazards of which they don't know (but presumably quite hazardous enough if you are told to go through those steps).

Japanese "panic" on a different level, I believe. They're generally much more calm than most other people I know.

I suspect a silent 'panic' where people just remain indoors and avoid going out to the extent when the health effects from that are worse than from radiation. Which is anyhow the case outside plume, where the radiation is not a problem in the first place. Also, see this:

keep in mind that this area was also damaged by quake, and some of it, by tsunami. And the supplies are not being delivered because those 'calm' non panicking Japanese, trusting their government, are nonetheless declining to deliver food etc etc to those 'remain indoors' regions. I don't know if that can be described as 'panic', or if we need a Japanese word for it, like tsunami.

 

[|Fred]

...

After a bit of press investigation about Daini's related press releases on the 21th
I'm incline to conclude that Reuter's paper is a source of miss representation of the actual information.


On the 21 april NISA press release is the following
http://www.mofa.go.jp/j_info/visit/...0422/foreign-press-briefing-20110422-meti.pdf

NISA SAID: (April 21st)
- The Prime Minister issued the following instruction in relation to the
accident at Fukushima Dai-ni NPS of TEPCO to the Governor of
Fukushima prefecture, and Mayors of Hirono-Town, Naraha-Town,
Tomioka-Town and Okuma-Town, in accordance with the provisions of the
Article 20, paragraph 3 of the Act on Special Measures Concerning
Nuclear Emergency Preparedness.
Instruction to change the evacuation area from within 10km
radius to within 8km radius from Fukushima Dai-ni NPS.

And On the 21 april Tepco's press released is the following http://www.tepco.co.jp/en/press/corp-com/release/11042108-e.html
http://www.tepco.co.jp/en/press/corp-com/release/betu11_e/images/110421e11.pdf
Its an update , but really a no change confirming the cold shutdown since march

What else would the milestone be? Just the passing of time?

yet an other press epic failure ? bit like this one http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-tg6gskQW-...Lo/Np23gFjKfQo/s1600/obama-bin-laden-dead.jpg

 

[MadderDoc]

Is it right that the last day 27.4. Tepco spray Water at Unit 4 ?
I found no more Press release.

I also haven't been able to find announcement of sprayings to that pool since the 27th.

 

[AntonL]

#3 RPV is 205C now, why ?
also only 1,6m water in #1 SFP

Here: http://www.meti.go.jp/press/2011/05/20110503001/20110503001-3.pdf (last page)

Yes, I can see that now, thank you. I think it is a measure of the temperature somewhere in the drywell. I can see too, that it has been on the increase for several days. If it shall not be dismissed as the result of a faulty sensor (which Tepco indicates that it might be), I am not sure how to interpret it. Corium in the drywell?

@MadderDoc you do not haver to "think it is a measure somewhere in the dry well", we just need to check the equivalent english version of this table to find out it is the temperature in the dry well at the RPV bellows seal. http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/english/files/en20110502-2-3.pdf but these are aways a view days late

And yes this temperature has drastically increased and is is also marked with #3 meaning that measurement is under evaluation and may not be correct but this increase even if measurement is faulty should worry tepco.

 

[MadderDoc]

<..>it is also impossible for me to conclude with 100% certainty that this image shows the bolt tightening equipment rather than the fuel bridge. Both are green, and there is nothing in that video that tells me I am looking at a device which is approximately round in shape.

Rule number 1 of pixel-twitching: Always look at something from more than one angle.

I think that piece of equipment may also be visible on one of the reactor 4 videos, possibly at an angle due to some floor collapse, I will go and have another look and see, it could easily be something else <..>

In unit 3, the bolt screwing machine does appear to be tilted down towards the west, likely because the floor under it has collapsed, and it is now standing on a slope.

 

[triumph61]

I also haven't been able to find announcement of sprayings to that pool since the 27th.

At 27.4 Tepco sprays. The Water steps 4250 to 6550mm.
Today Water still at 5550mm.
What is going on??

 

[maddog1964]

Unfotunately, reactor #1 is quite different from the others. We have some sketchy blueprints of #3's concrete srtucture, without the machinery:

http://www.ic.unicamp.br/~stolfi/EXPORT/projects/fukushima/povray/blueprint/good/

Reactors #2--#4 are said to have the same basic plan. What we can see through the holes on #3 and #4 seems to agree with the above blueprints. However there may be differences. The entrance on the ground floor, for example, looks different between #3 and #4.

Yes Jorge, I agree with what you are saying and that's why i clairify in the beginning that its #1, the process equipment still seems to be the same and in the same general location and (Its is just an assumption based on the lack of information) I should have made that clearer ... I have lousy monitor so its hard to look in the cavities... but have been working on chasing the equipment and pipe (as i do think some of the assumptions i see are inccorect or based as a fact (less so on this site) vs. an opioion.. I have found this site to be one of the more reliable..

My original concept that i was chasing is the contributing factors to the events... the Containment Vessel does not isolate all the Radioactve Components... ie the question of the "sludge removal" system.. the cleaning/water chemisty system is complex with many systems involved... There has been much past conversation about Rad limits and why they are at certain levels in odd places.. I have been trying to located the equipment that may contain (or have broken open) that could be the source of the Rad levels in certain places and not necssarly "fuel"...

while looking at the sludge system came across article refenceing the sludge tanks the Hartfod clean up site..(much bigger... not in reactor building) in it talks about "residule heat from the rad in the sludge being able to create Hydogen gas and Nitrous Oxide chemical reations.. (expoosive and flammible) " the sludge tank shown on the blueprint is a flat top.. not a pressure vessel

I am new to this form of communicating and apologize if I have approched it incorrectly...

I have enjoyed your post and was and still hoping that i could get some feed back on the chemistry part of the "secondary piping systems"

also on the Micky Mouse ears... can not see on the monitor very well but would you be so kind as to look and give me your comments..

When looking through the "scaffolding" it looks as though the blue/white can still be seen.. I have been in this busness a long time and can not think of a reason to put a tank on top of scaffold for safety reasons.. But with the clearer pictures you have posted it looks like that the wall is still there and (can you tell if the structure is an angel or tubing shape vs round) and the structure is a frame work that a tank (so not see any flanged ends to be heat exgr) has been mounted on the top and a system was to be installed on the lower half... maybe to feed something in one of the buildings or somewere else ... then the explosion and it just went away... this is just a wild *** guess.. don't see the remains around in after pictures.. the green box that was there looks like a typ weather/explos proof elc/instumention box...

thanks and will try to be more clear in the future... now do you know anything about the chemistry properties of the "sludge" and how hot would it be... or any guess?

 

[AntonL]

Latest Packbot video of unit 1.

Video taken 29 April 2011

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BL1kcB1ClBk"

what are we observing here? looks like racks in a spent fuel pool but of which unit? and what is the significance of the brown rods, yellow finger is waving up and down along this brown object in video, could this be an oxidized fuel casing?
[PLAIN]http://k.min.us/ikRUO0.JPG

 

[|Fred]

Those recurring conspiracy theories are getting a bit old... If you want to argue please do so with evidence and not based on assumption.

Absence of time line argument
During this crisis we were provided by more that one hundred more than daily update time lined...

March 11 : 21:23 Mayor of Okuma Town and the Mayor of Futaba Town were issued regarding the event occurred at Fukushima Dai-ichi. to prepare evac of 2 zones 3 and 10 km

"Secret" Data http://www.nsc.go.jp/mext_speedi/20110311/20110311.html on the 11

March 12
05:44 Residents within 10km radius from Unit 1 of Fukushima Dai-ichi NPS shall evacuate by the Prime Minister Directive.
07:45 Directives from the Prime Minister to the Governor of Fukushima Prefecture, the Mayors of Hirono Town, Naraha Town , Tomioka Town and Okuma Town were issued regarding the event occurred at Fukushima Dai-ni NPS to prepare
Direction for the residents within 3km radius from Fukushima Dai-ni NPS to evacuate
Direction for the residents within 10km radius from Fukushima Dai-ni NPS to stay in-house
17:39 The Prime Minister directed evacuation of the residents within the 10 km radius from Fukushima Dai-ni NPS.
18:25 The Prime Minister directed evacuation of the residents within the 20km radius from Fukushima Dai-ichi NPS.

secret data http://www.nsc.go.jp/mext_speedi/20110312/20110312.html
at 13:00 radiation was carried for the first time to the land , wind changed direction all day.
Radiation data 5x10^-15 to 5x10-17 MICRO Sievert/h in a 10km radius

March 15th
11:00 The Prime Minister directed the in-house stay area.
In-house stay was additionally directed to the residents in the area from 20 km to 30 km radius from Fukushima Dai-ichi NPS considering in-reactor situation.


I only checked the two first days.. hardly enough to conclude anything that may have accrued after..Again I don't mind you finding evidence of wrong doing.

And Again please check http://www.nsc.go.jp/mext_speedi/0312-0424_in.pdf What the hell
Children thyroid potential intake dosed above 100mSv this area, with 3 or 4 towns! outside the evac... That's something to be pissed at

 

[SteveElbows]

There is no way the evacuation was handled appropriately, and I am quite surprised that anybody thinks it was. Specifically, the government were negligent in how they handled the regions slightly outside the evacuation zone to the north west. I will have to try to go back and retrace the exact sequence of events to give a completely accurate picture, but I am sure that data was made available showing that parts of the north west really should be evacuated, and this data was available for quite some time before the Japanese government announced that they would eventually make people evacuate those areas. I will go and try to find more detail now.

OK here is what I found from the past.

A NHK World story that indicates that they were aware that the north west direction was where problems were, at least as early as March 16th when this story was published.

Japan's science ministry has observed radiation levels of up to 0.33 millisieverts per hour in areas about 20 kilometers northwest of the quake-damaged Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant.

Experts say exposure to such radiation for 3 hours would result in absorption of 1 millisievert, or the maximum considered safe for 1 year.

The ministry gauged radiation levels for 10 minutes from 8:40 PM local time on Tuesday at 3 places in Fukushima Prefecture, whose residents are being instructed to stay indoors. The measurements produced readings as low as 0.22 millisieverts per hour.

The USA's wider evacuation area did not give me any clues that the north west was an area to watch, but they did publish details on why their models told them that a 50 mile evacuation zone was appropriate. Document is dated March 15th:

http://www.nrc.gov/reading-rm/doc-collections/news/2011/11-050_Attchmt.pdf

The US evacuation being different to the Japanese one, along with the online SPEEDI results being unavailable in a way that looked like censorship, would have given some people in Japan a clue as to the reality at that point, but the government persisted with its more limited evacuation policy for some time to come.

On the 17th March there were further stories about high radiation levels in certain areas:

NHK has a round-up of radiation levels in towns around the stricken Fukushima plant. While the report insists there is, as yet, no danger to human health the figures are somewhat disquieting:

As of 9am Thursday, at Fukushima City, 65 kilometres north-west of the Fukushima Daiichi plant, radiation level was 13.9 microsieverts per hour. This is more than 340 times the usual background level.

At Koriyama City west of the plant, the reading was 2.71 microseiverts, 45 times the normal level.

South of the plant, in Iwaki City, radiation levels were as high as 20 times the usual level at 1.25 microseiverts.

At this point there had also been at least one model of probable plume direction available on the internet for a few days, and such models told a different story to the oversimplified 'its all blowing out into the ocean' weather story that the media often told.

On the 18th NHK world had this story, further evidence of problems to the north west. Sorry I can't link to it because NHK recycle their links every month it seems:

Japan's science ministry says relatively high radiation levels have been detected on 2 consecutive days about 30 kilometers northwest of the quake-damaged Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant.

The radiation measured 170 microsieverts per hour on Thursday and 150 microsieverts on Friday.

Chief Cabinet Secretary Yukio Edano says the government will take appropriate measures if this level of contamination continues in the area for a long period. But he says this would be unlikely.

Radiation was measured for 2 hours from 10AM on Friday at 18 spots in areas 30 to 60 kilometers from the plant in Fukushima Prefecture.

The highest reading of 150 microsieverts per hour was detected at around 1:30 PM local time, about 30 kilometers northwest of the plant. The location is within the zone where residents have been instructed to stay indoors.

Readings of 170 microsieverts were recorded at the same location at 2 PM on the previous day, Thursday.

Experts say exposure to this amount of radiation for 6 to 7 hours would result in absorption of the maximum level considered safe for one year.

The ministry also observed radiation levels of 0.5 to 52 microsieverts per hour at other observation points within a 30 to 60 kilometer radius of the plant. It says these levels are all higher than normal, but not an immediate threat to health.

The government has evacuated residents living within a 20 kilometer radius of the plant, and instructed those in a 20 to 30 kilometer radius to stay indoors.

Anyway that's the very early stuff, I'll post again with details of what came next.

 

[AntonL]

video http://vimeo.com/23186557"