Non Newtonian / Newtonian Fluid interface

In summary, the conversation discusses a scenario of a wave tank partially filled with a shear thickening Newtonian fluid (Oobleck) and a layer of water on top separated by a thin membrane. The question is how a surface wave in the water layer will behave at the interface between the Newtonian and Non-Newtonian fluid, if it will cause reflection, and if Snell's law will apply due to the higher density of Oobleck. The experts suggest that further modeling is needed to get a definitive answer and that the system is too complex to make simple predictions. The discussion also touches on the wave speed equation for water and the application of Snell's law in this scenario.
  • #1
Tom79Tom
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Suppose I have a wave tank partially filled with a shear thickening Newtonian fluid (Oobleck), on top of which sits a layer of water (separated by a thin membrane to prevent mixing)

If I propagate a surface wave in the water layer how will it conduct itself at the Newtonian/Non Newtonian Fluid interface and into the Non Newtonian fluid

Will it be an applied force upon the Non Newtonian fluid that causes shear thickening ? Will it cause reflection of the wave at the interface ?

I also notice that Oobleck has a higher density than water- will Snells law also apply and the surface wave will travel slower in the higher density medium
 
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  • #2
Tom79Tom said:
Suppose I have a wave tank partially filled with a shear thickening Newtonian fluid (Oobleck), on top of which sits a layer of water (separated by a thin membrane to prevent mixing)

If I propagate a surface wave in the water layer how will it conduct itself at the Newtonian/Non Newtonian Fluid interface and into the Non Newtonian fluid

Will it be an applied force upon the Non Newtonian fluid that causes shear thickening ? Will it cause reflection of the wave at the interface ?

I also notice that Oobleck has a higher density than water- will Snells law also apply and the surface wave will travel slower in the higher density medium
In my judgment, you need to do actual modeling of this problem to get a definitive answer. Neglecting surface tension, the boundary condition at the interface must be that the traction must be continuous (i.e., normal- and shear stresses).
 
  • #3
Tom79Tom said:
Suppose I have a wave tank partially filled with a shear thickening Newtonian fluid (Oobleck), on top of which sits a layer of water (separated by a thin membrane to prevent mixing)

If I propagate a surface wave in the water layer how will it conduct itself at the Newtonian/Non Newtonian Fluid interface and into the Non Newtonian fluid

The thin membrane will cause additional effects; better to consider (for example) oobleck and vegetable oil; the oil is Newtonian and immiscible with oobleck (or a cornstarch solution if you prefer that).

Otherwise, I agree with Chestermiller- the system is too complex (nonlinear, for one) to make 'simple' predictions.
 
  • #4
Thanks for your replys guys ! I'll ponder if another simpler scenario could answer my query
 
  • #6
Tom79Tom said:
Suppose I have a wave tank partially filled with a shear thickening Newtonian fluid (Oobleck), on top of which sits a layer of water (separated by a thin membrane to prevent mixing)

If I propagate a surface wave in the water layer how will it conduct itself at the Newtonian/Non Newtonian Fluid interface and into the Non Newtonian fluid

Will it be an applied force upon the Non Newtonian fluid that causes shear thickening ? Will it cause reflection of the wave at the interface ?

I also notice that Oobleck has a higher density than water- will Snells law also apply and the surface wave will travel slower in the higher density medium
For water waves
"In water whose depth is large compared to the wavelength, the wave speed expression contains two terms, one for gravity effects and one for surface tension effects. The wave speed is
Waves-basic-terms_clip_image002_0000.gif

where g is the gravitational field strength, γ is the surface tension, ρ is the density of the water, and λ the wavelength. As this equation makes clear (wave speed depends on wavelength), water is a dispersive medium."
(http://practicalphysics.org/speed-water-waves.html) [I made a couple of obvious typo corrections spotted in the original quote above regarding the quantites in the equation ...]
I don't know if that can help. Perhaps it's not enough.
Tom79Tom said:
I also notice that Oobleck has a higher density than water- will Snells law also apply and the surface wave will travel slower in the higher density medium
Snell's law (of refraction) involves the angles of incidence and refraction. For surface waves (i.e. in 2 dim), you have to be more careful and specify the exact geometry. (Are we talking about surface waves at the same level, with the interface surface between the two media perpendicular? ...)
 

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1. What is the difference between a Non Newtonian and Newtonian fluid?

A Newtonian fluid is a type of fluid that has a constant viscosity, meaning it flows at a consistent rate regardless of the amount of force applied to it. Examples of Newtonian fluids include water and air. On the other hand, a Non Newtonian fluid does not have a constant viscosity and its flow rate changes based on the amount of force applied to it. Examples of Non Newtonian fluids include ketchup, toothpaste, and blood.

2. How does the interface between a Non Newtonian and Newtonian fluid behave?

The interface between a Non Newtonian and Newtonian fluid behaves differently depending on the type of Non Newtonian fluid. In some cases, the interface will have a clear boundary between the two fluids, while in others, the fluids may mix and blend together. The behavior of the interface is also affected by the amount of force applied to the fluids.

3. What causes a fluid to be Non Newtonian?

A fluid becomes Non Newtonian when its viscosity changes in response to applied force or shearing stress. This can be caused by various factors such as the concentration of particles or polymers in the fluid, temperature, and pressure. The behavior of Non Newtonian fluids is more complex and can be categorized into different types depending on their response to stress.

4. Can Non Newtonian and Newtonian fluids be mixed together?

Yes, Non Newtonian and Newtonian fluids can be mixed together. However, the resulting mixture will exhibit properties of both fluids and may behave differently than either fluid on its own. This can be seen in some food products, such as salad dressings, which are a mixture of Non Newtonian fluids (e.g. oil and vinegar) and Newtonian fluids (e.g. water).

5. What are some real-life applications of Non Newtonian / Newtonian fluid interface?

The interface between Non Newtonian and Newtonian fluids has many practical applications. One example is in the production of paints and coatings, where Non Newtonian fluids are used to create a smooth and consistent texture. Another application is in the medical field, where Non Newtonian fluids are used in blood flow simulations and drug delivery systems. Non Newtonian fluids are also used in the production of cosmetics, adhesives, and many other products.

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