Accelerated expansion and perceived gravity

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of accelerated expansion of the universe and its potential effects on perceived gravitational fields on Earth. Participants explore whether fluctuations in gravitational field strength could be sensed due to the Earth's orientation relative to the universe's expansion throughout the day.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions if the Earth's position relative to the universe's accelerated expansion could lead to fluctuations in gravitational field strength perceived throughout the day.
  • Another participant argues that there is no "direction of acceleration" in the context of cosmic expansion, suggesting a misunderstanding of how the expansion occurs.
  • A different participant states that the effects of cosmic expansion are too small to be sensed on Earth, although they mention evidence from cosmic microwave background measurements that may relate to the universe's expansion.
  • One participant clarifies that "accelerated expansion" refers to coordinate acceleration, not proper acceleration, emphasizing that objects in the universe, including Earth, are in free fall and do not experience the effects described by the original question.
  • Several participants express concerns about the appropriateness of the question within the forum's labeling system, suggesting it may not align with advanced discussions.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express disagreement regarding the implications of accelerated expansion on perceived gravity, with some asserting that the effects are negligible while others question the understanding of the concepts involved. The discussion remains unresolved with multiple competing views present.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight limitations in understanding the nature of cosmic expansion and its effects, with some assumptions about gravitational perception being challenged. There is also mention of the need for clarity regarding the labeling of discussion topics within the forum.

sickwayne
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Since the universe is expanding at an accelerated rate and accelerating frames can perceive that motion as being the result of a gravitational field, have we ever been able to sense a gravitation field fluctuation in the Earth that occurs every 24 hrs? Would someone not be facing the direction of acceleration at some point in the day and be facing away from that direction 12 hrs later? Wouldn't this acceleration seem to add to and then subtract from our Earth's own gravitational field strength throughout the day?

Just curious-
 
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There is no "direction of acceleration". If you think so you have not understood how the expansion of the universe takes place - it is not about us moving away from a centre in an accelerated motion.

I also suggest you read this: Cosmology's sole "rate of expansion" is declining
 
The expansion is far too small for us to sense on Earth. Many orders of magnitude too small.
But, we can see evidence in sensitive measurements of the cosmic microwave background. We can measure a very small difference in the background radiation from one side of the sky and the other side which rotates around us every 24 hours. This is called the CMB anisotropy dipole moment, and is due to the Earth traveling with respect to the large-scale structures in our vicinity. This is due Doppler shift, which is due to velocity, not acceleration. But with higher order moments, it might be possible to see evidence of the accelerating expansion.
 
sickwayne said:
accelerating frames

"Accelerated expansion" does not imply "accelerating frames". The term "accelerated" in "accelerated expansion" means coordinate acceleration, not proper acceleration; the proper acceleration of the objects in the universe whose motion we describe as "accelerated expansion" is zero. They are in free fall, so locally they are at rest in an inertial frame and do not see any of the effects you describe. And the Earth itself is one of those objects (i.e., it is in free fall, so locally it is in an inertial frame), so it doesn't see those effects either.
 
This question seems to me to be a gross abuse of the "A" label. What do the heavy hitters think, and are the labels moderated?
 
m4r35n357 said:
This question seems to me to be a gross abuse of the "A" label.

You're right, fixed.
 
PeterDonis said:
You're right, fixed.

Drat, I thought I was moving to advanced!
 
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