Angular momentum, degeneracy pressure, and cosmic inflation

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the relationship between angular momentum, degeneracy pressure, and their potential roles in cosmic inflation, particularly in the context of collapsing stars and black holes. Participants explore theoretical models, including ekpyrotic universe models, while questioning the validity of certain claims and references related to these concepts.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants inquire whether angular momentum and degeneracy pressure can prevent a collapsing star from forming a black hole, suggesting a connection to cosmic inflation.
  • Others challenge the claim that angular momentum can prevent collapse to a black hole, asking for references and clarification on the source of this idea.
  • A participant mentions their understanding that a black hole requires a/m < 1, proposing that if the ratio is much higher than 1, the object may collapse to degenerate matter or a naked singularity.
  • Another participant elaborates on the conditions under which mass shedding can affect the a/m ratio during collapse, noting limits to this reduction and the implications for black hole formation.
  • Some participants express uncertainty about the physical reasonableness of naked singularities and the predictability of solutions involving them.
  • There is a discussion on the lack of exact solutions for rotating objects in gravitational collapse, emphasizing the complexity of the topic and the reliance on numerical simulations.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the relationship between angular momentum, degeneracy pressure, and black hole formation. Multiple competing views and uncertainties remain regarding the validity of the claims and the interpretations of the referenced materials.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the lack of established references for some claims, the dependence on specific definitions of angular momentum and mass ratios, and unresolved mathematical steps in the discussion of gravitational collapse and its implications.

stoomart
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Considering the angular momentum of a collapsing star preventing it from resulting in a black hole by degeneracy pressure, are there ekpyrotic universe models that include angular momentum and degeneracy pressure as key factors of cosmic inflation?
 
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stoomart said:
Considering the angular momentum of a collapsing star preventing it from resulting in a black hole by degeneracy pressure

Where are you getting this from? Can you give a reference?
 
Last edited:
stoomart said:
Here are some of the sources I was reading

None of these explain where you got the idea that angular momentum can prevent collapse to a black hole. Where did you get that idea from?
 
PeterDonis said:
None of these explain where you got the idea that angular momentum can prevent collapse to a black hole. Where did you get that idea from?
I will do some more digging to find the source, but it may have just been a misunderstanding of something I read, since I perceive all of this stuff heuristically and not mathematically.
 
PeterDonis said:
None of these explain where you got the idea that angular momentum can prevent collapse to a black hole. Where did you get that idea from?
Correct me if I'm wrong, but my understanding is a black hole requires a/m < 1, so if the ratio is much higher than 1, the object may collapse to degenerate matter or a naked singularity.

Wikipedia: Stellar rotation
Yale.edu: Angular momentum and the formation of stars and black holes
SAO/NASA ADS: Gravitational collapse and rotation. I - Mass shedding and reduction of the a/m ratio

Mass shedding can be effective in reducing the a/m of a collapsing configuration, but there is a limit in this reduction. For cases where the precollapse model is a uniformly rotating Newtonian spheroid, a/m cannot be reduced to less than ~40% of its initial value, unless there is significant redistribution of specific angular momentum on the collapse time scale...If follows that if the initial a/m is greater than 2.5, mass shedding alone cannot reduce the ratio sufficiently in a single collapse phase to allow a black hole to form, unless there is significant redistribution of specific angular momentum during that phase...
A second possibility is that the collapse could continue to situations of unbounded gravitational potential with a/m still greater that 1. A supporter of the cosmic censorship hypothesis would like to be able to positively exclude this, but we are unable to do so on the basis of our present analysis.​
 
stoomart said:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but my understanding is a black hole requires a/m < 1

More precisely, for a Kerr solution to be a black hole requires ##a / m \le 1##. Yes, that's correct. If ##a / m > 1##, the solution describes a naked singularity.

stoomart said:
so if the ratio is much higher than 1, the object may collapse to degenerate matter or a naked singularity.

First, we do not know of any exact solution for a rotating object like a planet or star (whereas we do have exact solutions that describe a non-rotating, perfectly spherical planet or star). Nor do we have an exact solution describing a rotating object that collapses to a Kerr solution for any value of ##a / m## (whereas we have an exact solution, the Oppenheimer-Snyder model, that describes the collapse of a perfectly spherical object to a Schwarzschild black hole). We can only simulate such a collapse numerically.

Second, "collapse to degenerate matter" is not really "collapse" in the sense you're using the term. If the process stops with a rotating white dwarf or neutron star, then there is no singularity or horizon anywhere, so there's no issue.

Third, while the ##a / m > 1## Kerr solution, describing a naked singularity, is mathematically consistent, AFAIK nobody believes it is physically reasonable. A naked singularity basically destroys the predictability of the solution--anything could come out of it. So I would not expect "collapse to a naked singularity" to be physically reasonable either.

Finally, although, as I said above, we do not have any exact solutions describing a rotating planet or star, all known rotating objects have ##a / m < 1## by a large margin. And it's straightforward to show that you cannot convert a Kerr solution with ##a / m < 1## to a Kerr solution with ##a / m > 1## by any continuous process (heuristically, the reason is that to increase ##a / m## you have to add more angular momentum to the object than you add mass, and the closer ##a / m## gets to 1 from below, the harder it gets to do this--you end up always adding more mass than you are trying to add because of the way spacetime curves close to the Kerr black hole's horizon). I don't know if anyone has tried to study a similar restriction on ordinary rotating objects, but I would expect there to be one--in other words, I would expect that it is impossible for any collapse process to convert a rotating object with ##a / m < 1## to a Kerr solution with ##a / m > 1##.
 
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