Angular Momentum Prob: Find Wfinal & Angle

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around a problem related to angular momentum, specifically focusing on finding the final angular velocity and the angle of a system involving a square platform and a person applying force. The context includes concepts of torque, moment of inertia, and angular velocity.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the relationship between torque and angular momentum, questioning how the force applied by the person affects the system's motion. There are attempts to derive equations for angular momentum and angular velocity, with some participants expressing uncertainty about their reasoning and calculations.

Discussion Status

Several participants are actively engaging with the problem, sharing their attempts and questioning the assumptions made regarding forces and motion. There is a recognition of potential complications in the reasoning, and some participants are reconsidering their approaches based on the implications of constant angular momentum.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the complexity of integrating angular velocity over time and the challenge of defining the relationship between the person’s motion and the platform’s rotation. There is also mention of initial forces and the implications of constant angular momentum, indicating a need for clarity on these concepts.

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Homework Statement



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w= ang velocity

L= ang momentum

I = moment of inertia

Homework Equations



r cross F = torque


moment of inertia of a horizontal square surface = 1/6 m a2

The Attempt at a Solution



The time taken should not depend on the rotation and should simply be a/v

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Assuming the angle above, the torque the man applies on the square should be independent of the rotation on the square and should only depend on the position of the man on the side of the square. Then from the geometry, the torque is

r*F = rFcos(theta) but r = (a/2)/ cos theta

then Torque = (a/2)F = (a/2)md2r/dt2

Integrating ang momentum L = [( ma/2) (dr/dt)]

Now the velocity of the man with respect to the platform, V = dr/dt - rw

so dr/dt = v+rw

sub in ang momentum eq, I get,

L = Iw = mav/2 + marw/2

at t = a/v, r is the diagonal = a/(2)1/2

so Lfinal = 1/6ma2wfinal=mav/2 + ma2w/2(2)1/2

then wfinal = V/((1/3)-1/(2)1/2))a

this is as far as I got, I get this nagging feeling that I have over thought this and made unnecessary complications, and also I can't integrate this Wfinal to get the angle since its not a function of time, just the final ang velocity. also not sure how to get r as a function of time, pls tell me what I am doing ( or thinking ) wrong.
 
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Hmm now it occurs to me that if he has applying a force on the platform, he can't possibly walk with a constant velocity, so there must be an initial force, but after that there can be no net force over time. so his ang momentum must be constant? :cry:
 
Thinking of this prob with constant angular momentum,

L = Iw = r*P = r*mv = rmvcos(theta)again, r = a/2cos(theta) then, Iw = 1/6ma2w = amv/2

then w = 3v/a,

integrating, theta = 3vt/a

at t = a/v, theta = 3 radians, I think it should be = -3 rad, with my sign convension,I'm not so sure about rt,

My best guess is,

Wman measured from space = Wman from platform - Wplatform

Here Wplatform was the w that we solved earlier

then, Vt/rt = V/rt - Wp

since, r is the same in both frames.

so, Vt + rtWp = V

diff w.r.t time,

d2r/dt2 + Wpdr/dt = 0

This is the S.H.M D.E, with soln,

rt = Acos ( (Wp)1/2t + phase angle)

here A has to be the max value of r, ie the diagonal of the square a/(2)1/2So rt = a/(2)1/2cos ((Wp)1/2t + phase angle)Can some1 tell me if I'm even close?
 
Last edited:
And my best guess is very very wrong :smile: that's not the S.H.M Diff eqn, if i solve that equation, i get an exponent in my soln and that can't be right, I'm sure rt has to be a sin or cos function.
 

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