Are You a Vegetarian? | Poll & Discussion

[Evo]

He claims that no one who has gone on this diet has ever had a heart attack; that some people have gone on this diet were in dire need of corrective heart surgery, but the disease was reversed through diet.

A damaged heart or valves cannot repair themselves, that's crackpottery.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

A damaged heart or valves cannot repair themselves, that's crackpottery.

He was talking about coronary artery disease. Obviously diet isn't going to repair a damaged valve.

Monique already posted his research.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

In case memory doesn't serve correctly, here is the interview.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p4hbV4RgzI8

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Also, the interview with Clinton.

http://www.cnn.com/2011/HEALTH/08/18/bill.clinton.diet.vegan/index.html

Eh, dirty trick! That's a highly edited version. This was the other part of special CNN ran about this, but also just an excerpt.

The 'heart attack proof' diet?
http://www.cnn.com/2011/HEALTH/08/19/heart.attack.proof.diet/index.html

 

[phoenix:\\]

Vegetarian throughout the year but I do eat a bit of meat during the holiday season, so mostly vegetarian aside from two dates on the calendar.

 

[Evo]

He was talking about coronary artery disease. Obviously diet isn't going to repair a damaged valve.

Monique already posted his research.

That was an unrelated list of papers that had his name listed.

 

[Monique]

That was an unrelated list of papers that had his name listed.

What do you mean unrelated, it's a list of his peer-reviewed publications. Among them publications where he makes the claims of lifestyle changes and cardiovascular disease. Those are more on-topic than popular media statements that are known to distort facts.

People are free to look at his publications, the second one is very recent research. Here is an older publication that supports the claim of regression of coronary artery disease based on intensive lifestyle changes http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9863851

I don't have time to dig into it much further, but he also has publications on diet alone.

 

[KingNothing]

If there are any vegetarians in this thread, could you explain the rationale behind eating some meats?

 

[PAllen]

There are no vegetarians or vegans if single celled animals are counted. Then where is the threshold.

 

[Pythagorean]

There are no vegetarians or vegans if single celled animals are counted. Then where is the threshold.

single-celled are not classified as animals. You really need tissues/organs to be metazoan, technically.

Still, there are plenty of multicellular animals that are small enough to hide in a salad and not give a taste.

edit: to take a guess: probably many draw the line at vertebrae.

 

[PAllen]

single-celled are not classified as animals. You really need tissues/organs to be metazoan, technically.

Still, there are plenty of multicellular animals that are small enough to hide in a salad and not give a taste.

edit: to take a guess: probably many draw the line at vertebrae.

Ah, then let them eat escargot!

 

[Evo]

There are no vegetarians or vegans if single celled animals are counted. Then where is the threshold.

There are all kinds of little crustaceans called copepods in your water.

http://blogs.scientificamerican.com...er-look-at-new-york-citys-tap-water-monsters/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copepod

 

[PAllen]

There are all kinds of little crustaceans called copepods in your water.

http://blogs.scientificamerican.com...er-look-at-new-york-citys-tap-water-monsters/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copepod

I know.

 

[feathermoon]

I'm a veggie, and an athlete. I mentioned in another thread, but I do Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, power lifting, and running.

One thing I'd recommend all vegetarians (especially in academia) supplement with is creatine monohydrate. I'm not positive what the commercial source is, I assume its synthetic but I'm not positive so it may not be strictly vegetarian. However, studies have shown that vegetarians who supplement with creatine (as they no longer have any in their diet) show increases in memory, as well as anaerobic energy.

I've been veggie for 11 years now, so I've had a lot of time to consider where to draw the line. For me, personally, its vertebrates. I guess that makes lobster and crabs okay to me, but not fish. Insects are natures most plentiful food source, maybe, so its not very ecologically impacting if I wanted to go that route. However, I'm not in a hurry to eat either. Go figure. Milk and eggs are just fine if I need fat or protein.

 

[Kholdstare]

I eat peanut, jelly, spam, butter, spam, bread, spam, spam, spam, chicken, spam, spam, spam, spam, steak, spam, spam, spam, spam, spam, spam, spam...

 

[PAllen]

I eat peanut, jelly, spam, butter, spam, bread, spam, spam, spam, chicken, spam, spam, spam, spam, steak, spam, spam, spam, spam, spam, spam, spam...

No spamming on PF!

 

[daveb]

No spamming on PF!

There's always time for spam, spam, spam, spam, spam, spam,...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anwy2MPT5RE

 

[Danger]

I am a strict carnivore. The only pleasure that I derive from eating is in knowing that something died violently so that I could eat it. Vegetables are not food; they're what food eats.

 

[Pythagorean]

You could, if you chose, kill vegetables violently. They're not big screamers though.

 

[Danger]

You could, if you chose, kill vegetables violently. They're not big screamers though.

I'm not so sure about that. The ex had the intellect of a vegetable, but she screamed like a wounded wombat.

 

[Kholdstare]

I eat two things. Sandwich, pasta, jelly ... THREE things. Sandwitch, pasta, jelly, steak ... FOUR things. Sandwitch, pasta, jelly, steak, burger ... FIVE things ...

 

[turbo]

My dog would be a vegetarian in the summer if I gave him free run of the garden. As it is, he picks and eats all the low-lying raspberries and blackberries. He'll gladly dig up and eat carrots and pick his own tomatoes, string beans, and peas. I have to watch him when he gets near the tomatoes because the stems/collars are toxic.

 

[feathermoon]

Anyone know much about mycoprotein sources?

 

[dimension10]

I like plants, they are pretty and make oxygen for us. Why people find it okay to senselessly kill them, take their fruit, and subsequently feed off of them is beyond me. I eat meat and try to minimize the pain plants must go through in order for me to survive.

Cows, on the other hand, cause global warming and are plant murderers. They made their decision and I am simply seeking justice.

Also, what kind of option is "Vegetarian but I eat some kinds of meat"? THEN YOU'RE NOT VEGETARIAN. That's like saying you're a mathematician but you also do useful things.

Plant murderers? :)

By eating meat however, the animals have eaten the plants before. By eating 1 kilogram of meat, its like eating 16 kilograms of grain and 4000 litres of water. So that is more. But plants can't feel pain. They have no nervous system, and I remember seeing that those experiments confirming plant perception also prove metals feel pain, which is totally nonsensical!

 

[dimension10]

That's not B12, it's a methylated form of it. Lots of "health food" shops sell these scammy products as supplements for vegans, but they aren't bioavailable forms. There is no bioavailable form in plants. Some supplements of cobalamin are produced from bacterial sources, and can be used, but there are far more scams out there than legitimate products.

Humans evolved to require a diet that includes some animal products. It doesn't need to be daily, and it doesn't need to be meat, but it does need to be an animal product of some sort...raiding the chicken house for a few sterile eggs now and then is fine. There's no sane reason to deny a person all animal products. But, instead of eatingna few animal products, they'd rather support an industry that manufactures synthetic vitamins, packages them up in plastic bottles, and ships them over long distances, and may not even be a usable form of the vitamin.

Although I consume dairy, I disagree. I am sure humans were always herbivores. Look at our teeth, intestines, stomach acid, etc. All matches a herbivore.

What about B12?

If only we wouldn't wash our vegetables, we would get loads of B12... But sadly we do, so dairy is the ethical option.

 

[dimension10]

If there are any vegetarians in this thread, could you explain the rationale behind eating some meats?

Pesco-vegetarians, Pollo-vegetarians, Pesco-Pollo-vegetarians, Ovo-Pesco-Vegetarians, Lacto-Pesco-vegetarians, Ovo-Lacto-Pesco-Vegetarians, Lacto-Pollo-vegetarians, Ovo-Pollo-vegetarians, Ovo-Lacto-Pollo-vegetarians, Ovo-Lacto-Pesco-Pollo-vegetarians, Ovo-Pesco-Pollo-vegetarians, Lacto-Pesco-Pollo-Vegetarians and various types of Buddhist or Hindu Non-vegetarians don't eat some kinds of meat either because...

1. They think some meats are healthy (if they do it for health reasons), which is a myth.
2. They think that some meats are ethical, which is totally a myth, because no animal suffers like a chicken or a turkey.
3. They think some meats are environmentally friendly, which is a myth.
4. They think that some meats do not cause famine, which again, is a myth.
5. They do it because they were born like that, for religious reasons.

 

[dimension10]

So true...

It is not very far...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_vitro_meat#Ethical_considerations
http://www.peta.org/features/In-Vitro-Meat-Contest.aspx

 

[dimension10]

Even from past threads, I have generally noticed that PF is more non-vegetarian friendly (i.e. seems to have higher number of non-vegs).

I guess that is because there are more meat-eaters than vegetarians in this world...

 

[dimension10]

Though I consume dairy, vegans could get B12 if only they didn't wash our vegetables.

 

[Topher925]

Although I consume dairy, I disagree. I am sure humans were always herbivores. Look at our teeth, intestines, stomach acid, etc. All matches a herbivore.

What about our canines? Those weren't developed for eaten shrubs.