Ball in 2D plane as a countable union of rectangles

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Homework Help Overview

The problem involves demonstrating that the open ball in the plane defined by {|x| < 1} can be expressed as a countable union of rectangles, while the closed ball defined by {|x| ≤ 1} cannot. The discussion centers around concepts in set theory and topology, particularly relating to countability and the properties of convex shapes.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the relationship between rational and real numbers in the context of countability, suggesting that the countable nature of rational rectangles may help cover the open ball. Questions are raised about how to demonstrate that a set of rational rectangles can cover the open ball without touching the boundary of the closed ball.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants exploring various approaches to cover the open ball with rectangles. Some guidance has been offered regarding the properties of rational rectangles and their relation to the boundaries of the balls, but no consensus has been reached on the specific methods to demonstrate the coverage.

Contextual Notes

Participants are considering the implications of using rational numbers in their arguments and the nature of convexity in relation to the closed ball. There is an acknowledgment of the challenge posed by the uncountability of certain sets, particularly in relation to points on the boundary of the closed ball.

Chasing_Time
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Hi all, I'm getting stuck on this problem.

Homework Statement



I am asked to show that that the open ball in the plane {|x|} < 1} can be written as a countable union of rectangles [a_1, a_2] x [b_1,b_2], but the closed ball in the plane {|x| <= 1} cannot be written as a countable union of rectangles.

The Attempt at a Solution



I believe it has something to do with the fact that the rationals are countable but the reals are not, and extending this relationship to 2-D. For a given rectangle (a1, a2) X (b1, b2), to get the open ball one could keep halving the distances |a2 - a1| and |b2 - b1| for each rectangle, and since the operation is halving the set the result is still countable, and further, the product will be countable as well as the union of all such rectangles. But to get the closed ball must invoke irrational numbers- I believe this has something to do with the fact that the ball is convex, but I'm not sure how to incorporate that either. At least a starting point would be very helpful. Thanks so much.
 
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How about the set of ALL rectangles R with a1, b1, a2 and b2 rational and R is contained in O={|x|<1}. That's countable, right? Can you show it covers O? To go the other way, take a point x such that |x|=1 and, say, x is in the first quadrant. Can you show that if x is in a rectangle contained in C={|x|<=1} then x is the upper right corner of the rectangle? How many points are there on the first quadrant of the of the circle |x|=1? Can you show it's uncountable?
 
Yes- this is all coming together now. I'm just unable to show that the set R can cover O = {|x| < 1}.
 
Chasing_Time said:
Yes- this is all coming together now. I'm just unable to show that the set R can cover O = {|x| < 1}.

Pick a point y in O. Can't you show pretty easily that there is a rational rectangle that contains y but doesn't touch the boundary circle C={|x|=1}? The distance from y to C is positive.
 

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