Basic implicit differentiation question

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the application of implicit differentiation to find the derivative dx/dt for the equation x = r cos(θ), where both r and θ are functions of time t. Participants explore the reasoning behind the differentiation process and the appropriate application of the chain rule.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses uncertainty about the application of implicit differentiation and questions why dx/dt is not simply (-rsinθ)(dθ/dt).
  • Another participant suggests that implicit differentiation is unnecessary since x is expressed explicitly in terms of r and θ.
  • A third participant assumes that x is a function of t through both r and θ, and provides a detailed expression for dx/dt using the chain rule.
  • A fourth participant reiterates the chain rule for functions of multiple variables, supporting the previous responses and providing a formula for dx/dt.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the necessity of implicit differentiation in this context. There are differing views on the correct approach to finding dx/dt, with some advocating for the chain rule and others questioning the need for implicit differentiation.

Contextual Notes

Some participants assume specific dependencies of variables on t, while others do not clarify these dependencies, leading to potential ambiguity in the discussion.

influx
Messages
162
Reaction score
1
So it has been quite a few years since I learned about implicit differentiation so the content is a bit rusty in my mind.

x=rcos(θ)

How do you find dx/dt?

I know the answer but I am trying to figure out why. I mean dx/dt can be written as (dx/dθ)*(dθ/dt) so why is the answer not just (-rsinθ)*(dθ/dt)?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
You have to know which variables in the RHS which depends on ##t##. By the way, you don't need implicit differentiation in this case since what you want to find is ##dx/dt## and ##x## in your equation has been expressed explicitly in terms of the other variables.
influx said:
so why is the answer not just (-rsinθ)*(dθ/dt)?
So you know the right answer? It will be helpful to post it as well.
 
influx said:
x=rcos(θ)

How do you find dx/dt?
Since you have not specified otherwise, I assume that you really have x(t)=r(t)\cdot \cos(\theta (t)). Then \frac{dx(t)}{dt}=\frac{dr(t)}{dt}\cdot \cos(\theta(t))+r(t)\cdot\frac{dcos(\theta(t))}{dt}=\frac{dr(t)}{dt}\cdot \cos(\theta(t))+r(t)\cdot(-\sin(\theta(t)))\frac{d\theta(t)}{dt}
 
For x a function of two variables, r and \theta, where r and \theta are functions of t, the "chain rule" is
\frac{dx}{dt}= \frac{\partial x}{\partial r}\frac{dr}{dt}+ \frac{\partial x}{\partial \theta}\frac{d\theta}{dt}
That gives Svein's answer.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
3K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
3K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
2K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
3K
  • · Replies 19 ·
Replies
19
Views
5K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
3K