Can Public Caning and Castration Effectively Curb Rape in Malaysia?

[Saint]

Our malaysia parliament had proposed the following penalties to rapists on top of jail:

1) Caned in the public
2) Castration, remove his genital


Our women's bodies fully support these proposals, they said that these penalties will effectively curb raping.

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[Saint]

The rapists who did INCEST will be punished more severely, we proposed Whole Life Jail + public caning + castration ,

there are many malay and indian fathers raping own daughters until pregnant and give birth to infirmity children, that kind of father always threatens his daughters not to expose his evil deed or he will kill them.
Quite often there are cases father forces his daughters to do oral/anal sex with him. Terrible!

 

[Gokul43201]

Bad idea. I think you need a case by case penalty assessment...but I'm sure that's not your cup of tea.

 

[Saint]

these types of ANIMAL fathers did what is not even done by beast, they deserve severe punishment

 

[chroot]

So... once again, let me get this straight.

• A man who repeatedly rapes his daughters, eventually resulting in pregnancy and sick infants, gets caned in public, or castrated, or perhaps life in jail.
• The person who brings a thimble-full of heroin into the country gets killed.

Gee, your country is really one screwed up place. Remind me to never visit.

- Warren

 

[Saint]

We are Civilised enough to practise justice!
No drug No rape!
Not like you, agree with all kinds of immorality!
SHAME [/size]

 

[BoulderHead]

You make comedy look easy!

 

[Artman]

As Gokul43201 said, I think each case should be considered individually. However, in some cases, I think that public caning, castration and jail time is a reasonable and fair penalty for the crime.

Some in the US might consider that cruel and/or unusual punishment, but when you consider the emotional and physical harm inflicted on the victim, I consider it justice. The crime has probably ruined sex as an enjoyable occurance for the victim and in many cases physically harmed their sex organs, so the punishment fits the crime. The caning would give the offender a taste of the shame, degradation and helpless feeling felt by their victim.

It may also act as a deterent to others witnessing the punishment, but then again, jail time and threat of execution should be a deterent in crimes such as murder, but does not seems to be.

 

[Smurf]

Ah yes, punishing people. Always been one of mankind's favourite past times.

It may also act as a deterent to others witnessing the punishment, but then again, jail time and threat of execution should be a deterent in crimes such as murder, but does not seems to be.

I disagree, I can't remember the last time I heard of a senseless killing (but then I am in Canada). only when conditions were very extreme or the killers were mentally ill. Threats don't help then.

 

[Artman]

Ah yes, punishing people. Always been one of mankind's favourite past times.


I disagree, I can't remember the last time I heard of a senseless killing (but then I am in Canada). only when conditions were very extreme or the killers were mentally ill. Threats don't help then.

Little clip from a report on the effects of the death penalty in deterring murderers.

According to the FBI's Preliminary Uniform Crime Report for 2002, the murder rate in the South increased by 2.1% while the murder rate in the Northeast decreased by almost 5%. The South accounts for 82% of all executions since 1976; the Northeast accounts for less than 1%. Read the report. (FBI Preliminary Uniform Crime Report 2002, June 16, 2003).

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/article.php?scid=12&did=167

 

[Gokul43201]

Just Google "dna pardon rape" to see why rape cases are not as cut and dried as Saint believes.

An aside : What's common to all of the following countries (and no others) ?

Bangladesh, Belarus, Botswana, Chad, China, Congo, Cuba, Egypt, Iran, Iraq, Japan, Jordan, Kazakhstan, North Korea, Kuwait, Malaysia, Mongolia, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, Singapore, Somalia, Sudan, Taiwan, Thailand, Uganda,
United States of America, Uzbekistan, Vietnam, Yemen, Zimbabwe

 

[Moonbear]

Assuming life in prison in Malaysia really means for the rest of your life, not like in the US where it means maybe 12 years until they let you out on parole, then why add the caning and castration? Chemical castration is used in the US for those released from prison as a way of preventing them from physically being able to commit the act again. It has been thought that reducing the testosterone levels would also reduce their urge to commit these acts as well. However, I saw a poster at a conference last year (don't know if it's published yet), where they were studying pedophiles who had been chemically castrated to determine if they really did stop having urges or if it was just preventing them from becoming physically aroused. From the results they had at the time of the conference, it looked like the urges had not been prevented at all, or very minimally. (As a similar phenomenon, consider the behavior of a male dog castrated in adulthood rather than as a puppy...they will still attempt to mate with other dogs despite lacking testes). The danger is that there are other ways to sexually abuse someone other than with a penis, and there is no "cure" for offenders. It may just give people a false sense of security to castrate sexual offenders, either chemically or surgically, so that becomes more of an uncivilized seeking of revenge more than an effective punishment. The hope for castration was not to do it as punishment, but to make it safe for these offenders to be released from prison to become productive members of society again. If it is not safe for these people to return to society, then locking them in prison for life, or in a high security mental institution...I don't care which...seems the only option.

And, I have to agree, the penalties don't seem to fit the crimes, even on a relative scale. A violent person (rapist) is allowed to live, while someone just trying to escape reality for a while with the aid of some white powder gets a death sentence. That seems really backward.

 

[Artman]

...It may just give people a false sense of security to castrate sexual offenders, either chemically or surgically, so that becomes more of an uncivilized seeking of revenge more than an effective punishment. The hope for castration was not to do it as punishment, but to make it safe for these offenders to be released from prison to become productive members of society again...

I read somewhere that eunuchs can make and sustain erections for very long periods of time. So, if the person was castrated by traditional means, rape with penetration could still be possible. However, there is also the fact that castration makes the possibility of pregnancy very unlikely from an attack (I'm not sure about sterilization using chemical castration).

 

[pig]

Chemical castration is used in the US for those released from prison as a way of preventing them from physically being able to commit the act again.

What?? Are you serious? Is this voluntary or forced?

 

[check]

An aside : What's common to all of the following countries (and no others) ?

Bangladesh, Belarus, Botswana, Chad, China, Congo, Cuba, Egypt, Iran, Iraq, Japan, Jordan, Kazakhstan, North Korea, Kuwait, Malaysia, Mongolia, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, Singapore, Somalia, Sudan, Taiwan, Thailand, Uganda,
United States of America, Uzbekistan, Vietnam, Yemen, Zimbabwe

I'm guessing public executions?

 

[chroot]

We are Civilised enough to practise justice!
No drug No rape!
Not like you, agree with all kinds of immorality!
SHAME [/size]

I think you missed my point. (Gee, was that unexpected?)

My point is that your punishments for a father literally completely destroying his daughter's mental and physical well-being for life warrants a punishment less severe than someone having a small quantity of a drug.

Most sane people would argue that rape, a violent crime, should come with a higher penalty than narcotics possession, a non-violent crime.

For the record, Americans don't agree with all kinds immorality. What do you think? Do you think raping your daughter and shooting up heroin are legal in the US?

- Warren

 

[check]

We are Civilised enough to practise justice!
No drug No rape!
Not like you, agree with all kinds of immorality!
SHAME [/size]

Civilised? Please.

There is no civility in public executions, a legal system based on ‘guilty until proven innocent’ or mutilation as punishment.

 

[Moonbear]

What?? Are you serious? Is this voluntary or forced?

Voluntary. Usually as a condition for early parole.

 

[Saint]

our severe punishment on having drugs serves as an intimidation on people who plan to trade drugs!
nip it in the bud!

 

[chroot]

our severe punishment on having drugs serves as an intimidation on people who plan to trade drugs!
nip it in the bud!

Yet your less severe punishment for child-rapers indicates that your society feels drug trafficking is a bigger crime than child-raping. This frankly bothers me, and I hope I'm not alone.

Of course, I am aware that many cultures, particularly Asian cultures, place less value on human life than we do in western cultures. It still bothers me.

- Warren

 

[Moonbear]

Yet your less severe punishment for child-rapers indicates that your society feels drug trafficking is a bigger crime than child-raping. This frankly bothers me, and I hope I'm not alone.

Of course, I am aware that many cultures, particularly Asian cultures, place less value on human life than we do in western cultures. It still bothers me.

- Warren

This puzzles me too...unless swift death is considered a lesser punishment than having to spend an entire lifetime in prison with no genitals. Maybe being raped by other inmates is a harsher punishment than death. I've heard the same argument before for life in prison vs death penalty...that death is a quick end (i.e., no suffering), easier than having to suffer in prison for your crimes. I'm just making a mental note to never travel to Malaysia. Isn't that where some American kid who shoplifted something made international news because he was sentenced to public caning as his punishment?

 

[ShawnD]

So... once again, let me get this straight.

• A man who repeatedly rapes his daughters, eventually resulting in pregnancy and sick infants, gets caned in public, or castrated, or perhaps life in jail.
• The person who brings a thimble-full of heroin into the country gets killed.

Gee, your country is really one screwed up place. Remind me to never visit.

Why not just rape rapists?

 

[Smurf]

Now we know why Malaysia has such a poor tourist industry.

 

[cragwolf]

Rape is an extremely violent crime, and, in my opinion, deserves to be punished with a very long jail term. In a recent case in my country, a home, inhabited by a teenaged girl and her parents, was invaded by 4 men, who each proceeded to rape the girl repeatedly in front of her tied-up parents. Imagine the anguish and suffering that these 3 family members will have to go through for the rest of their lives. You can't -- it's a bottomless pit. As far as I'm concerned, the men deserve life without parole.

Punishing drug traffickers as severely or more severely than rapists is evidence of a society with very skewed values.

 

[Gokul43201]

Don't you folks get all afraid of Malaysia because of their laws...unless of course, you plan on getting high there or kidnapping someone, 'cause that'll be the death of you.

I've been there a couple of times, and it's a beautiful place - definitely worth visiting.

 

[Saint]

Now we know why Malaysia has such a poor tourist industry.

Wrong, we have increasing number of tourists from China,
chinese are safe to move around in this world, not like the American white people, subject to terrorist attack anytime, you have created too many enemies !

 

[Saint]

Gokul , where do you download our penal code?

 

[chroot]

Wrong, we have increasing number of tourists from China,
chinese are safe to move around in this world, not like the American white people, subject to terrorist attack anytime, you have created too many enemies !

I have to say you're an idiot, Saint. At the very least you're an insane bigot.

Terrorists have attacked in Russia, France, Spain, Turkey, England, and many, many other countries. We are not the only society under attack. It should be noted that the US has historically had one of the most open immigration policies in the world.

- Warren

 

[Smurf]

Chroot is right, the USA has not been under neraly as much violent attack as other places in the world. But its also thru that they are generally disliked in most places outside of the US and are more prone to Attacks in places like the middle east.

 

[Saint]

you're idiot instead of me!
if terrorism is not a Great Threat to America, why Bush uses it as a topic for his presidential campaign?

 

[chroot]

That's simple. Because Bush wants to get re-elected, and fear sells.

- Warren

 

[Vast]

OK, back on topic.

There was a documentary on the History channel a few days ago about the rapist Richard Baker. (I think) Apparently people like this start crawling the walls because their scared to death from the threats of the other inmates. However later on there was some footage showing him with other inmates discussing how good life was in prison! Apparently he had become the other inmates btich, taking hormones so he could have breasts, and wearing silk underwear! (A horrible sight I assure you!)

If their having such a jolly good time in prison, is that justice?!

 

[Artman]

If their having such a jolly good time in prison, is that justice?!

My firm employed a former prison maintenance supervisor who told us some stories about prison life. One person he told us about was physically abused so frequently that his anal muscles lost full control. He occasionally dripped so badly from his rectum that he would leave a trail behind him. Just one of many stories. Trust me, you do not want to go to prison.

 

[Smurf]

I hope you realize I was eating when I read that.

 

[Artman]

I hope you realize I was eating when I read that.

Sorry Smurf. It is disgusting.

 

[wolram]

Rape is one of the most difficult crimes to prove, as often it is one
persons word against the others, but if it can be proved then a first
offence should warrant a term in jail, a second offence should incur
sterilising by whatever means.
Incest, well people like West commit that ultimate horror, I have had
an idea that if all murderers rapists etc were sent to a remote island
and left to there own devices they wouldn't survive very long and
would be a fitting punishment.

 

[Dooga Blackrazor]

I believe rapists should simply be placed in jail and forced to do manual labor to contribute to society. My definition of fate is: The result of one of many innumerable outcomes. Rapists may have made the wrong decision in doing what they did but that doesn't mean they don't deserve to live like everyone else. Probabilty simple caused them to be evil. As long as they can still be made to contribute it's a waste of a resource to discard rapists.

 

[Gokul43201]

I have had an idea that if all murderers rapists etc were sent to a remote island and left to there own devices they wouldn't survive very long and would be a fitting punishment.

Until someone decides to make this into a reality show. :zzz:

 

[Moonbear]

I have had
an idea that if all murderers rapists etc were sent to a remote island
and left to there own devices they wouldn't survive very long and
would be a fitting punishment.

Isn't that what Britain tried a long time ago with Australia? Seems folks are doing pretty well down there.

 

[Smurf]

Accually they were mostly theives.

 

[Saint]

Some people in malaysia proposed to legalise prostitution so that rape case can be reduced, but i this both are irrelevant.
We actually have protitution in many small hotels,police close one eye and ignore them, the rapist actually can get chic if he wants.

 

[Moonbear]

Well, it's no wonder you're so fascinated with these topics. I learned tonight that Malaysia is ranked 5th in the world for the number of jails per capita 1.13 jails/1000 people! (It's actually first in total number of jails, but I thought the per capita value was a fairer estimate...don't want to compare big, medium, and small countries based purely on numbers). Seems all those punishments are stopping the crimes from happening, just putting more and more people behind bars. It's surprising there's anyone left there who isn't in jail with so many jails!
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph-T/cri_jai_cap

 

[Moonbear]

Some people in malaysia proposed to legalise prostitution so that rape case can be reduced, but i this both are irrelevant.
We actually have protitution in many small hotels,police close one eye and ignore them, the rapist actually can get chic if he wants.

Are you saying it's okay to rape prostitutes?

 

[Saint]

no,
i didn't agree with that proposal,
it is hard for us to do an acid test of that.

 

[fisipavia]

But Saint didn't mean raping prostitutes was the solution, he said that in the case that the rapist just wanted to have sex there are plenty of prostitutes and the police do nothing to prevent prostitution...so, it doesn't matter that prostitution is not legal. The rapist rapes not just because he wants sex, so legalizing prostitution will not help.