Centripetal force on a vehicle while cornering

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SUMMARY

The discussion centers on the concept of centripetal force as it relates to vehicles, specifically cars and bikes, during cornering. It emphasizes Newton's third law, stating that for every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction, which manifests when a vehicle exerts an outward force on the road while turning. The centripetal force necessary for circular motion is provided by friction, which results from electromagnetic interactions between the vehicle and the Earth. The conversation also highlights the counterintuitive nature of these forces, comparing vehicle dynamics to a football player's movement when changing direction.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of Newton's laws of motion
  • Basic knowledge of centripetal force and friction
  • Familiarity with vehicle dynamics during cornering
  • Concept of electromagnetic interactions in physical systems
NEXT STEPS
  • Explore the principles of centripetal acceleration in detail
  • Research the role of friction in vehicle handling and performance
  • Study the effects of mass and inertia on vehicle cornering
  • Investigate the relationship between steering input and vehicle dynamics
USEFUL FOR

Automotive engineers, physics students, driving instructors, and anyone interested in understanding the mechanics of vehicle motion during cornering.

Mohamad
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According to the Newton's third law "For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction." When a car (or a bike) turns, How does the car (bike) exert force outward (in the opposite direction of centripetal friction force)?
 
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For a car to move in a circle there must be some centripetal force, which through friction on the road is provided by electromagnetic interactions of the matter making up the Earth with the matter making up the car. Neglecting retardation to stay within the approximations of Newtonian physics, the 3rd Law (i.e., spatial translation invariance) implies that the car exerts an opposite force of equal magnitude on the Earth.
 
Mohamad said:
How does a car (or a bike) exert force outward (in the opposite direction of centripetal friction force)?
Friction between two objects means two equal but opposite friction froces, each on one of the objects.
 
A.T. said:
Friction between two objects means two equal but opposite friction froces, each on one of the objects.
I mean, that is counter-intuitive that when you turn the steering wheel, car exerts an outward force (perpendicular to the car) on the road.
 
Mohamad said:
I mean, that is very counter-intuitive that when you turn the steering wheel, car exerts an outward force (perpendicular to the car) on the road.

Think of a football player that is avoiding a defender by making a quick change of direction. He digs in the side of his foot and pushes off in the opposite direction. The force of the shoe on ground compresses some dirt. The force of the ground on the shoe is what pushes him off. The interaction between the shoe and the ground is analogous to the tires and the street.
 
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Mohamad said:
I mean, that is counter-intuitive that when you turn the steering wheel, car exerts an outward force (perpendicular to the car) on the road.
When you run over a rug, and try to make a turn, the rug can slide outwards if not fixed.
 
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Mohamad said:
According to the Newton's third law "For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction." When a car (or a bike) turns, How does the car (bike) exert force outward (in the opposite direction of centripetal friction force)?

You can consider the force (action) and the opposite only considering the whole system, car and earth. The two forces give zero sum for the whole system.

At steering Earth will counter rotate, (if perfectly rigid body), but i will not even try to measure how much.
In reality Earth will counter rotate for the force remaining at net of all dissipative effect ending in heat (deformation of tires, asphalt, road substrate, dow to geology deformation..) i think close to zero.
The main forcesarise from there mechanical effects, outside the car.

maybe a more clear situation is straight acceleration, a car star accelerating (big), the Earth accelerate (very little) in opposite direction, the two forces are equals and opposite, the difference is in the mass of the two objects of the system.
Centripetal acceleration from steering is the same.
 

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