Charge on three metallic plates

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the behavior of three metallic plates with a charge Q on the middle plate, which is free to move. The problem involves understanding the forces acting on the middle plate due to the charge distributions on the outer plates and the implications of the distances d1 and d2 between the plates.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the charge distributions on the plates and question how to calculate the force on the middle plate. There is discussion about whether to use the total charge or the effective charge for force calculations.
  • Some participants consider the implications of electric fields generated by the charges on both sides of the middle plate and whether these fields can be shielded by the metallic plate.
  • There are references to Gauss' law and its application in understanding the electric fields and forces involved.

Discussion Status

The discussion is active, with participants sharing various perspectives on the charge distributions and electric fields. Some guidance has been offered regarding the application of Gauss' law and the behavior of electric fields in relation to the metallic plates. Multiple interpretations of the problem are being explored without a clear consensus on the correct approach.

Contextual Notes

Participants are navigating assumptions about the nature of electric fields in conductors and the distribution of charges on the plates. There is an emphasis on understanding the interactions between the plates and the resulting forces, with some participants expressing confusion over the implications of their calculations.

  • #31


Abdul Quadeer said:
its Q/Aε (if A=area of the plates)
It should be half that, because the charge is divided over two equal surfaces of area A, and the gaussian surface used contains only the charge on one face. The field inside the conductor is zero.

The distance between the plates does not affect the distribution of charges (as long as it is not infinite). The neutral plate remains neutral with 0 charge on both sides.

Look up "Charge-induced charge separation". The neutral plate will become polarized.
 
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  • #32


SammyS said:
The charge on the outside is (should be) outside of the Gaussian surface.

The Gaussian surface can emerge from both sides of the plate as it has a continuous charge distribution. It is not discrete.

gneill said:
It should be half that, because the charge is divided over two equal surfaces of area A, and the gaussian surface used contains only the charge on one face. The field inside the conductor is zero.

Yeah I missed the 2.

gneill said:
Look up "Charge-induced charge separation". The neutral plate will become polarized.

Metallic plate gets polarized?? :
 
  • #33


why are you making such an easy question so complicated...

the capacitor made of the 1st plate and left side of middle plate has no field outside it ... so i won't have any force on the charge on the right side of middle plate and and third plate
 
  • #34


Abdul Quadeer said:
Metallic plate gets polarized?? :

Yup. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrostatic_induction" .
 
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  • #35


Abdul Quadeer said:
Metallic plate gets polarized?? :

yes because they have free electrons

even dielectrics gets polarized
 
  • #36


cupid.callin said:
why are you making such an easy question so complicated...

the capacitor made of the 1st plate and left side of middle plate has no field outside it ... so i won't have any force on the charge on the right side of middle plate and and third plate

Yeah I got it now. The field on the right side of the middle plate gets canceled due to the first plate and the left side of the middle plate. I was very much confused and surprised after reading post #16. I figured out that its wrong.

gneill said:
Yup. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrostatic_induction" .

That is NOT polarisation of metals :rolleyes:
Polarisation is the characteristic property of those materials which don't have free electrons. Metals have free electrons and they get induced.
 
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  • #37


Abdul Quadeer said:
That is NOT polarisation of metals :rolleyes:
Polarisation is the characteristic property of those materials which don't have free electrons. Metals have free electrons and they get induced.

Sorry, but when there is a separation of opposite charges in an object, the object can be said to be polarized --- it has a "+" end and a "-" end. Whether or not the separation occurs due to induction or by some other method of sequestering or implanting the charges is irrelevant.
 
  • #38

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