Area enclosed by a function involving 2 power towers

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the function $$f(x)=(−ln(x↑↑(2k)))↑↑(2k+1)$$ and the area it encloses as the parameter $$k$$ varies. Participants explore the behavior of this function, particularly focusing on the differences in area under the curves for successive values of $$k$$, and whether these differences converge to a constant value as $$k$$ approaches infinity. The scope includes mathematical reasoning and exploratory analysis of convergence.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant observes that while the area under the graph increases with $$k$$, the rate of increase diminishes, suggesting a potential limit as $$k$$ approaches infinity.
  • Another participant challenges the conclusion that differences going to zero imply convergence, citing the divergence of the harmonic series as a counterexample.
  • A request for assistance is made regarding how to prove that $$1 > f_k > f_{k-1}$$ for all $$x$$ between $$0$$ and $$1$$, indicating uncertainty about convergence concepts.
  • A proposed approach includes bounding the integrand and showing relationships between the functions for different values of $$k$$ to establish the inequalities necessary for convergence.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the implications of the differences approaching zero, with some asserting that this is not sufficient for convergence. There is no consensus on the convergence of the area under the curve as $$k$$ approaches infinity, and the discussion remains unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference various mathematical properties and inequalities, but the discussion includes unresolved assumptions and steps necessary for proving convergence. The dependency on the definitions of convergence and the behavior of the functions involved is acknowledged.

Saracen Rue
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TL;DR
Evaluate the following integral ##\int_0^1 ((−ln(x↑↑(2k)))↑↑(2k+1))dx## as ##k \to \infty##
I've been playing around with Up-Arrow notation quite a lot lately and have come up with the following "thought experiment" so to speak. Consider the following function: $$f(x)=(−ln(x↑↑(2k)))↑↑(2k+1)$$ $$\text{Where }k∈\mathbb{Z} ^+$$

In the image below we can see some examples of what this function looks like for the first ##5## values of ##k##:
Multivalued double power tower function final.png


It can be visually seen from the graphs that while the area under each graph does become larger for increasing values of ##k##, the rate at which the area is increases decrease. However, I went ahead and took the liberty of doing the calculations anyway. I found the difference in area between ## f_{k=2}(x)## and ## f_{k=1}(x)##, and then between ## f_{k=3}(x)## and ## f_{k=2}(x)##, and so on. I then took these values and plotted them as such:

Regression graph final.png


(Note: The graphs of ##f_{k=10}(x)##and ##f_{k=11}(x)## weren't included previously, they are only being used here now to help with the accuracy of the curve fitting)

Each point was plotted in the following manor: ##(1, \int_0^1(f_{k=2}(x)-f_{k=1}(x))dx), (2, \int_0^1(f_{k=3}(x)-f_{k=2}(x))dx), \text{etc}.##

The points were found to fit the general relationship of ##y_A \approx m_1 x_A^{a_1x_A+b_1}+c_1## extremely well, have an ##R^2## value very close to ##1##. This leads me to believe that this relationship appropriately represents the difference in area between different values of ##k## in ##f(x)##. Therefore, because this regression curve approaches ##0## as ##x## approaches ##\infty##, the area enclosed by the graph of ##f(x)=(−ln⁡(x↑↑(2k)))↑↑(2k+1)## must approach a constant value as ##k \to \infty##.

So, we know it does approach a constant value, we just need to find out what said value is. In other words, we need to evaluate $$\int_0^1 ((−ln(x↑↑(2k)))↑↑(2k+1))dx \text{ as } k \to \infty$$
 
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The differences going to zero is not sufficient. ##\displaystyle \sum \frac 1 n## has the differences between partial sums going to zero, too, but clearly the sum diverges.

I think you can prove that 1 > fk > fk-1 for all x between 0 and 1, that is sufficient for convergence.
 
mfb said:
The differences going to zero is not sufficient. ##\displaystyle \sum \frac 1 n## has the differences between partial sums going to zero, too, but clearly the sum diverges.

I think you can prove that 1 > fk > fk-1 for all x between 0 and 1, that is sufficient for convergence.
Thank you for letting me know. I was never taught about convergent/divergent series in school, so I'm still not very confident with this area of maths. I would very much appreciate if you could help with how to go about proving ##1## ##>## ##f_k## ##>## ##f_{k-1}## for all ##x## between ##0## and ##1##.
 
This should work (details to be worked out):
  • Show that ##1/e \leq x↑↑(2k) \leq 1##. It follows that ##0 \leq -\ln( x↑↑(2k)) \leq 1##, which means your integrand is between 0 and 1. That gives the upper bound on the integral.
  • Show that ##x↑↑(2k) \leq x↑↑(2k-2)##. It follows that ##-\ln( x↑↑(2k)) \geq -\ln( x↑↑(2k))##.
  • Show that ##x ↑↑ (2k+1) > x ↑↑ (2k-1)## and that ##x ↑↑ (2k+1) > y ↑↑ (2k+1)## for x>y.
  • Combine step 2 and 3 to show that ##f_k > f_{k-1}##.
 

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