Disproving an incorrect theorem?

  • Context: Undergrad 
  • Thread starter Thread starter YamiBustamante
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Theorem
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the evaluation of a theorem that claims if x and y are real numbers such that x + y = 10, then x cannot be 3 and y cannot be 8. Participants are analyzing the validity of a proof attempting to demonstrate the theorem's correctness and exploring the concept of counterexamples.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the proof provided for the theorem, suggesting that it incorrectly assumes the negation of the theorem.
  • Another participant expresses confusion about how to construct a counterexample to disprove the theorem, specifically regarding the values of x and y.
  • There is a discussion about the correct negation of the theorem's conclusion, with one participant clarifying that the negation is "x = 3 or y = 8."
  • Some participants indicate that the proof is flawed, leading to uncertainty about the theorem's validity.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the validity of the theorem or the proof. There are multiple competing views regarding the negation of the theorem and the interpretation of counterexamples.

Contextual Notes

There is uncertainty regarding the definitions and implications of negation in the context of the theorem, as well as the proper formulation of counterexamples. The discussion reflects varying levels of understanding about these concepts.

YamiBustamante
Messages
17
Reaction score
0
Incorrect Theorem:
Suppose x and y are real numbers and x + y = 10, then x != 3 and y != 8.

(a) What’s wrong with the following proof of the theorem?

Proof. Suppose the conclusion of the theorem is false. Then x = 3 and y = 8. But then x + y = 11, which contradicts the given information that x + y = 10. Therefore the conclusion must be true.

(b) Show that the theorem is incorrect by finding a counterexample.So according to the answer it's false because x != 3 can't be proven with x = 3 because that's not the negation, but even so, isn't the theorem true because 3 + 8 = 11 which does contradict the premise... I'm very confused by this...

For b, the counter example was x = 3 and x = 7 but how does that disprove it? I'm still very confused by counter examples.
So would it be written as "Suppose x and y are real numbers and x + y = 10, then x = 3 and y = 7" Is that how the counter example would be written?

Please explain!
 
Physics news on Phys.org
YamiBustamante said:
Proof. Suppose the conclusion of the theorem is false. Then x = 3 and y = 8.

That is not the negation of the theorem.
 
micromass said:
That is not the negation of the theorem.
So the proof is false so therefore the theorem is false or is the theorem already false to begin with, so proof would also be false...
 
micromass said:
That is not the negation of the theorem.
Never mind. I figured it out. Thank you.
 
In the statement, the conclusion is "then ##x \ne 3 \text{ and } y \ne 8##"

The negation of the conclusion is ##x = 3 \text{ or } y = 8##. I believe this is what micromass was alluding to.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
2K
  • · Replies 16 ·
Replies
16
Views
3K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
3K
  • · Replies 14 ·
Replies
14
Views
2K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
3K
  • · Replies 24 ·
Replies
24
Views
3K