Do Isomorphic Groups Have Isomorphic Centers?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the properties of isomorphic groups, specifically focusing on the relationship between the centers of these groups. The original poster presents a proof attempt regarding the isomorphism of the centers of two isomorphic groups, G and H, and explores the implications of this relationship in the context of group theory.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster attempts to establish a well-defined map between the centers of the groups and shows that this map is a homomorphism. Some participants question the completeness of the bijection argument, suggesting additional clarification on the inverse mapping. Others introduce related concepts, such as automorphisms and the significance of conjugation in establishing isomorphisms between automorphism groups.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants providing feedback on the proof attempt and raising related questions about the nature of automorphisms. There is an exploration of different methods to approach the problem, particularly regarding the use of conjugation in the context of automorphisms.

Contextual Notes

Participants are navigating the complexities of group theory, including the definitions and properties of isomorphisms and automorphisms. There is an implicit understanding of the constraints of the homework context, as participants engage in clarifying and expanding upon the original proof without providing direct solutions.

Mr Davis 97
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Homework Statement


Prove that if the groups ##G \cong H## are isomorphic then ##Z(G) \cong Z(H)##

Homework Equations

The Attempt at a Solution


Let ##\phi: G \to H## be an isomorphism. Define ##f: Z(G) \to Z(H)## s.t ##f(z) = \phi (z)##.
First, we will show that this map is well-defined, in the sense that elements in ##Z(G)## are always mapped to elements in ##Z(H)## by ##f##:

Let ##z \in Z(G)##. Then ##zg=gz## for all ##g \in G##. This implies that ##f(zg)=f(gz) \implies \phi (z) \phi (g) = \phi (g) \phi (z)## for all ##g##. But ##g## is arbitrary and ##\phi## is bijective, so ##\phi (g)## is an arbitrary element of ##H##. Hence we have ##\phi(z)h=h \phi(z)## for all ##h \in H##, which means ##f(z)h=h f(z)## for all ##h \in H##. So ##f(z) \in Z(H)##.

Next, we show that ##f## is an isomorphism: It is clear that ##f## is a homomorphism, since it is defined in terms of ##\phi##. It remains to show that ##f## is a bijection: ##f## is invertible, and the inverse is ##f^{-1} = \phi^{-1}##.

Hence ##Z(G) \cong Z(H)##
 
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Correct. The bijection part is a bit short, e.g. you could have added that ##f^{-1}## which isn't defined yet, is into ##Z(G)## for the same reason as ##f## was, that is that ##\phi^{-1}## can be restricted to the centers, too.

And I won't say that this is a matter of ... I basically have written this in order to say at least something besides "correct".
 
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fresh_42 said:
Correct. The bijection part is a bit short, e.g. you could have added that ##f^{-1}## which isn't defined yet, is into ##Z(G)## for the same reason as ##f## was, that is that ##\phi^{-1}## can be restricted to the centers, too.

And I won't say that this is a matter of ... I basically have written this in order to say at least something besides "correct".
I have one question that's slightly related to this one, and one which I don't want to create a new thread for. In trying to show that ##G \cong H \implies \operatorname{Aut} (G) \cong \operatorname{Aut} (H)##, one supposes that ##\phi : G \to H## and considers the map ##\theta:\text{Aut}(G)\rightarrow\text{Aut}(H)## defined as ##\theta(\psi)=\phi\circ\psi\circ\phi^{-1}## where ##\psi \in \operatorname{Aut} (G)##. One can then go to easily show that ##\theta## is an isomorphism.

My question is, is there some reason why considering the map ##\theta## is the right thing to do? How would have I thought to consider that map?
 
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Mr Davis 97 said:
I have one question that's slightly related to this one, and one which I don't want to create a new thread for. In trying to show that ##G \cong H \implies \operatorname{Aut} (G) \cong \operatorname{Aut} (H)##, one supposes that ##\phi : G \to H## and considers the map ##\theta:\text{Aut}(G)\rightarrow\text{Aut}(H)## defined as ##\theta(\psi)=\phi\circ\psi\circ\phi^{-1}## where ##\psi \in \operatorname{Aut} (G)##. One can then go to easily show that ##\theta## is an isomorphism.

My question is, is there some reason why considering the map ##\theta## is the right thing to do? How would have I thought to consider that map?
The most naive way is to define ##\phi \circ \psi## or ##\psi \circ \phi^{-1}## but then we land in the wrong group and we have to come back somehow. So the conjugation appears because of this.

Another way is to consider a commutative diagram with inner automorphisms
\begin{aligned}
G &\;\quad \stackrel{\phi}{\longrightarrow} &H\\
\downarrow{\iota(g)}&&\downarrow{\iota(h)}\\
\operatorname{Inn}(G) &\;\quad \stackrel{\theta}{\longrightarrow} &\operatorname{Inn}(H)
\end{aligned}
and make it commute. If there is a formula, substitute the inner by any automorphism.

The third way was my first thought: directly think of conjugation. It is a standard method in group theory, because it solves the problem of coming back. You can automatically think of conjugation whenever the word automorphism is used, either as a construction method like above, or as an example of an automorphism. If something should work for all automorphisms, it has to work for the inner, too.
 
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