News Does the US administration owe an apology to the French ?

[The Smoking Man]

Good, cause you need to. You post are completely irrational...

If you say so Townsend.

I bow to your logic.

Continue.

 

[Smurf]

No.. no... you've lost me again.

 

[edward]

It all depends on what the definition of is is.

One of the first efforts of the U.S. Army corp of Engineers was to build a water treatment plant. Not a plant to provide drinking water, but a plant to clean up river water so that it could be injected into oil wells.

We spent about $225 million dollars which includes the power to do the water injection work, and there is talk about spending more money because the water injection is Iraq ’s first priority,” said Meekins.


Designed to process raw river water from a tributary of the Euphrates River , Qarmat Ali plant works as follows.

Treating the water first removes small solids from the river that could plug the reservoir pores if it builds up. Water treatment also controls the acidity level and stymies bacterial growth. Left untreated, the reservoir could clog, not only reducing the oil flow, but requiring well repairs, re-perforating the well or, at worst having to redrill the well, according to a report done by Kellogg, Brown and Root (KBR), which began construction on the treatment plant in March 2003 at the direction of the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers.

http://www.grd.usace.army.mil/news/releases/recon112404.html

There were no water treatment plants for doing this under Saddam , otherwise we would have found them and used them. Hence Iraq must have been injecting silt laden water into the wells. Salt water is only available in the extreme south eastern oil fields of Iraq, hence unfiltered river water was used.
Is this really so difficult to understand? Or is someone just trying to pull someone else's strings, in an attempt to show his self perceived superiority?

Regardless, the French, Germans, and Russians still got screwed out of their oil agreements with Iraq. Now, however, we want them to come on down and help clean up the mess we have made.

 

[Townsend]

Is this really so difficult to understand?

That is what I have been saying...and hence why I questioned the reason why TSM needed to say that the US is pumping salt water into the well to pressurize them. I don't understand what his point of saying that was and I cannot get an answer out of him for the life of me.

 

[edward]

That is what I have been saying...and hence why I questioned the reason why TSM needed to say that the US is pumping salt water into the well to pressurize them. I don't understand what his point of saying that was and I cannot get an answer out of him for the life of me.

Salt water is preferred because it has a higher specific gravity and sinks to the bottom. salt water is being used by the U.S. in southern Iraq.

He didn't contradict himself by switching from salt to river water. His point was water injection in general. I understood his point perfectly.

 

[Smurf]

He didn't contradict himself by switching from salt to river water. His point was water injection in general. I understood his point perfectly.

Heh.. you're the only one.

 

[Townsend]

Salt water is preferred because it has a higher specific gravity and sinks to the bottom. salt water is being used by the U.S. in southern Iraq.

He didn't contradict himself by switching from salt to river water. His point was water injection in general. I understood his point perfectly.

What was it then?

 

[edward]

What was it then?

Basicaly that the U.S. is having to revive some of Iraq's neglected wells by putting a lot of time money and water into them. Whereas we had expected to go into Iraq and just start pumping out that liquid gold for free.

 

[Townsend]

Basicaly that the U.S. is having to revive some of Iraq's neglected wells by putting a lot of time money and water into them. Whereas we had expected to go into Iraq and just start pumping out that liquid gold for free.

I can see that...

I just don't know why couldn't I just get such a simple straight forward answer from TSM?

 

[The Smoking Man]

I can see that...

I just don't know why couldn't I just get such a simple straight forward answer from TSM?

I did, you dick.

If you go back to the quote of what it is I said that I keep posting and re-posting for you: It is the USA who are digging the hole for themselves. Especially when they tested the wells and found that due to the abuses of the 'oil for food' system which allowed little for well maintenance had been reduced to a 20% efficiency with only a possibility of recovery to a maximum of 80%.

You'll find that I have been trying to explain to you from the beginning that it was Saddam that pumped crap into the wells. Every quote I have given you is pre war dealing with 1997/1998.

You keep on bringing up what America has done since like some broken record and insinuation that I said something about this. Now Edward is telling you what the US is having do to bring systems on-line... So that they have a method of BILLING Iraq for a portion of 'OIF'.

At the war's end, Iraq was still incapable of sustaining itself even WITH all the oil in the ground because of what had been done to it and the lack of maintenance upgrades.

You simply DON'T read what is written.

And as far as you're, 'You're the only one' crack ... so far Smurf and Edward have come out and tried to explain it to you and indeed ... of the 4 of us, you're the only one to demonstrate an ignorance of the technology or the English used to explain it to you.

 

[vanesch]

Basicaly that the U.S. is having to revive some of Iraq's neglected wells by putting a lot of time money and water into them. Whereas we had expected to go into Iraq and just start pumping out that liquid gold for free.

Yup, so they broke into what they thought was Ali Baba's Cave, and found a pile of rubbish.

 

[The Smoking Man]

Yup, so they broke into what they thought was Ali Baba's Cave, and found a pile of rubbish.

Sorta like Geraldo and Al Capone's Hotel.

And to think ... they sent Geraldo home early frim Iraq.

 

[kat]

Originally Posted by edward
Basicaly that the U.S. is having to revive some of Iraq's neglected wells by putting a lot of time money and water into them. Whereas we had expected to go into Iraq and just start pumping out that liquid gold for free.

Oookay, great supposition but where's your evidence?

 

[The Smoking Man]

Oookay, great supposition but where's your evidence?

That would be post 153 when he quoted the military source.

 

[outsider]

Oookay, great supposition but where's your evidence?

again, with the one liner that says nothing...

kat, do you believe that ojay simpson is innocent? If you say, yes... there you go...

 

[cronxeh]

The French invented terrorism, back in 1790's during French revolution, and now they are all of a sudden 'against the war'. Not to mention that French are only 60million in population - a piss ant colony on global scale of anyone important

They can just as well shut the hell up

 

[NewScientist]

The french didn't invent terrorism - the word comes from an Arabic word and the 'first' terrorists were in about the 12th century and it was where an Islamic teacher instructed men to kill other men with the belief that they would go to heaven and have 7 pure blood virgins.

That may not be 100% accurtate but its far clsoer than claiming some oppressed, starving masses of 1790 were the 1st terrorists.

NS

 

[Smurf]

The French invented terrorism, back in 1790's during French revolution, and now they are all of a sudden 'against the war'. Not to mention that French are only 60million in population - a piss ant colony on global scale of anyone important

They can just as well shut the hell up

I am dumbfounded how you can consider the french revolution as terrorism, but not oh... the minutemen in the american revolution? The greek rebels when Rome took control? What the hell are you getting at Cronxeh, I really don't want to believe you're a bigot, please say something intelligent.

 

[Smurf]

Basicaly that the U.S. is having to revive some of Iraq's neglected wells by putting a lot of time money and water into them. Whereas we had expected to go into Iraq and just start pumping out that liquid gold for free.

I disagree. Getting more oil would only allow a more constant, cheaper supply into the US. The companies don't want that, burning oil wells and having all extractions problems, everything that's happening is what's driving prices up, and giving the companies big bucks. The point of invading Iraq is to make oil scarce so they can raise the price for it.

Maybe that's why they support the Saudi regime too, they know that if any non-oppressive regime were to come in there would be a lot less dissent and all the sudden the oil would be more regular and surplus.

 

[NewScientist]

I bit of research and I can make my post more accurate!

The 'first' Islamic terrorists were about 10 - 25 and were from the 11 century and were followers of Al-hassan Ibn-al-Sabbah, and they killed only Muslims.

 

[Art]

The french didn't invent terrorism - the word comes from an Arabic word and the 'first' terrorists were in about the 12th century and it was where an Islamic teacher instructed men to kill other men with the belief that they would go to heaven and have 7 pure blood virgins.

That may not be 100% accurtate but its far clsoer than claiming some oppressed, starving masses of 1790 were the 1st terrorists.

NS

Don't they get 12 vestal virgins these days? Must be index linked to the standard of living or something

 

[NewScientist]

Well I believe that it is 12 nowadays although it may not always have been so

 

[TRCSF]

The french didn't invent terrorism - the word comes from an Arabic word and the 'first' terrorists were in about the 12th century and it was where an Islamic teacher instructed men to kill other men with the belief that they would go to heaven and have 7 pure blood virgins.

That may not be 100% accurtate but its far clsoer than claiming some oppressed, starving masses of 1790 were the 1st terrorists.

NS

Oh, for crying out loud. The english word "terrorism" comes from the english word "terror," which comes from the latin word... wait for it... "terror."

The word "assassin" is derived from the arabic name "hashshashin" (lit. people who consume the drug hashish), a cult from 8th to the 14th century, mostly known for their politically motivated assassinations of the Abbasid elite.

For crying out loud people. Open a book.

 

[vanesch]

I am dumbfounded how you can consider the french revolution as terrorism, but not oh...

I think he's referring to the period just after the revolution called La Grande Terreur when Robbespierre had some fuses blowing in his brain and became totally paranoia, chopping heads off all over the place... until they chopped his head off.
Now, it is probably not the best translation to translate "La Grande Terreur" into the Big Terrorist :-)

 

[NewScientist]

Oh, for crying out loud. The english word "terrorism" comes from the english word "terror," which comes from the latin word... wait for it... "terror."

The word "assassin" is derived from the arabic name "hashshashin" (lit. people who consume the drug hashish), a cult from 8th to the 14th century, mostly known for their politically motivated assassinations of the Abbasid elite.

For crying out loud people. Open a book.

Ah yes that would be right also you could have aid derived from terrour the french or terrere but hey oops! And he is right baou tthe assasin thing! And the cult that consumed hashish were the men I referred to above who were convinced into their acts by Al-hassan Ibn-al-Sabbah.

 

[Smurf]

I think he's referring to the period just after the revolution called La Grande Terreur when Robbespierre had some fuses blowing in his brain and became totally paranoia, chopping heads off all over the place... until they chopped his head off.

Oh. Okay. Being completely ignorant is better than being a bigot at least.

Now, it is probably not the best translation to translate "La Grande Terreur" into the Big Terrorist :-)

Yeah, and the word Terreur wasn't invented at that time, or later to describe that time. Besides, it was 16th century French so most likely had a rather different meaning and/or spelling, ect.

 

[Smurf]

Ah yes that would be right also you could have aid derived from terrour the french or terrere

Yes, they got terrorism from the French word for dirt. I think if that's what he was thinking I'm going back to bigot, no human is that stupid unless they want to be.

Besides, the Latin word probably existed before the French word by only about a millenium.

 

[Art]

What currently existing government is older than the US government? To my understanding there is none...so unless I am incorrect (which I could be and would appreciate being properly informed if that is in fact the case) then in so far as a country is its government the United States of America is the oldest country in the world.

Of course we are young if you are to consider a country the same country even though they may have drastically different governments. To me once a government is abolished that country is dead and from whatever government forms at that point, it becomes a new nation. France may have the same name as it did 200 years ago but it is not the same country where as the US has had the same government since westners populated this land.

I'm catching up on this thread a little late but in case nobody has answered you yet, how about Britain. Their gov't is called the mother of all parliaments because ... Yes, you've guessed it! It's the oldest still existing parliamentary gov't in the world. That is what the US gov't is modeled on.

 

[NewScientist]

Did you also know the UK has no constitution! Interesting fact I think!

And townsend I would like to ask you - did the Dutch or French have the same government as modern day US? For they were the first settlers, along with the British.

 

[Smurf]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_constitution

Wiki is your friend.

 

[Townsend]

Did you also know the UK has no constitution! Interesting fact I think!

And townsend I would like to ask you - did the Dutch or French have the same government as modern day US? For they were the first settlers, along with the British.

This is old...it has already been hashed out...


What I was talking about, in case anyone still wants to know, is http://www.digitalhistory.uh.edu/database/article_display.cfm?HHID=283 ...

Which I was using to justify my position... however I was wrong to say the US has the oldest government in a strict sense.

Ok?

 

[NewScientist]

The only bones I would pick with your argument is that, like america, computing began from a simple electronic background that has not changed, wire are still used etc, but they have been improved over time and now the product is a million miles from where it all began. America too has moved on a long way - think of the census part of your laws that state that the population of America shall be determined by adding the whole number of free persons, and three fifths of all other persons (black people and slaves) - is that the correct attitude today, has America not changed?

 

[Townsend]

has America not changed?

The constitution is for the living

My point is that the US government was designed to allow for change to happen and so the fact that it is different means it is still the same.

 

[Art]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_constitution

Wiki is your friend.

It doesn't have a written constitution and so parliament can enact any legislation they like which can not be challenged on constitutional grounds which means they never have to have referendi to enable them to change or pass a law.

The only written document which is the one from which parliament originally derived it's powers is the Magna Carta which is viewed as a nice antique these days rather than a legally binding document.

What I was talking about, in case anyone still wants to know, is http://www.digitalhistory.uh.edu/da...ay.cfm?HHID=283 ...

Which I was using to justify my position... however I was wrong to say the US has the oldest government in a strict sense.

Yes Britain is not unique there are others as well. In fact were it not for Britain and the US there would be many others

 

[NewScientist]

Cheers Art for clearing that up so well!

i was commenting however, that the bedrock of america, a rebelling society which was the centre for the exploitation of slaves, murder and ethnic cleansing is far different to what it is now - the whole of amercia, from the bottom up has changed. Another analogy I may draw on is that of Christianity, the bible has essentially never changed but the interpretations of it have change drastically.

 

[cronxeh]

Smurf, since you are a minor I will go easy on you

First of all this is a political terrorism, and you won't understand why French invented modern terrorism which was adopted by Lenin, Stalin, Hitler, and in modern times the Al Qaeda.

 

[Smurf]

Wrong thread cronx

 

[Art]

Smurf, since you are a minor I will go easy on you

First of all this is a political terrorism, and you won't understand why French invented modern terrorism which was adopted by Lenin, Stalin, Hitler, and in modern times the Al Qaeda.

Hope you don't mind if I step in but when you say modern terrorism are you arbitrarily setting the clock at the French revolution thus making your statement a self supporting truth?

Political terrorism goes back many years prior to the French revolution. In fact some of the early exponents were the Zealots, Jewish men who would attack Roman and Greek authorities in broad daylight, in front of large groups of spectators, to send a message to the ruling body that they were not wanted there. There were also the Sicari who were also jews who murdered other jews who had fallen from their religious faith.

The term terrorism was indeed coined during the French revolution (Robespierre) but modern terrorism is generally ascribed to the mid 19th century when an Italian revolutionary, Carlo Pisacane theorized that terrorism could deliver a message to an audience and draw attention to and support for a cause.

 

[TRCSF]

France invented terrorism? Just what are they teaching in Jr. high these days.

Look, kids, terrorism means using violence or the threat of violence on civilian populations, in order to reach some political outcome.

Examples:

Flying planes into office buildings in order to get foriegn troops out of Saudi Arabia.

Burning down churches in order to keep black people from voting.

Blowing up protestants in order to get foreigners to leave your island.

Terrorism wasn't invented by either the French or the Muslims, regardless of what any Jack Chick tract has to say about it.

It was never invented. It's been around as long as humanity, which is either hundreds of thousands of years, or 6000 years; depending on whether or not you're a Bush supporter.

 

[Townsend]

... or 6000 years; depending on whether or not you're a Bush supporter.

There is such a thing as an agnostic Bush supporter.

 

[TRCSF]

There is such a thing as an agnostic Bush supporter.

You're either with him or you're against him.

 

[stoned]

after all your posts guys, look likes France must apologize to the great US of A for something.

 

[outsider]

You're either with him or you're against him.

I think i'll try to get on his side and see what all this hype is all about... i wonder how long i can last?