What are the rules for drawing molecular diagrams?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the rules and methods for drawing molecular diagrams, particularly focusing on the challenges faced when dealing with larger molecules. Participants explore how to determine atomic connections and oxidation states in complex structures.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions how to draw a molecule like pb2SO4 and seeks guidance on the rules for atomic attachment in larger molecules.
  • Another participant suggests that the initial molecule may be incorrect due to a misunderstanding of lead's valence and emphasizes the consistent nature of the sulfate anion (SO42-).
  • A participant expresses uncertainty about determining oxidation states in molecules containing lead and sulfur, indicating a lack of shortcut rules for larger molecules.
  • It is proposed that larger molecules are often constructed from known "blocks" such as sulfate or nitrate anions, which have fixed compositions and charges.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the validity of the proposed molecule or the best methods for drawing larger molecular structures. Multiple competing views regarding the understanding of valence and oxidation states remain present.

Contextual Notes

Participants express limitations in their understanding of how to connect atoms in larger molecules and the absence of straightforward rules for determining oxidation states, particularly in complex structures.

leroyjenkens
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If I have a molecule of pb2SO4 for example, how would I draw that? What are the rules that tell me what attaches to what? When it's only 3 or 4 atoms, it's pretty easy to draw them, but when it's more than that, I have no clue what to do.
 
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Never heard about such molecule -- I guess you got valence of lead wrong.

This is sulfate - and as such contains SO42- anion, which is the same in all sulfates.
 
Borek said:
Never heard about such molecule -- I guess you got valence of lead wrong.

This is sulfate - and as such contains SO42- anion, which is the same in all sulfates.

Maybe I got it wrong. I had a test today that required that I find out the oxidation states of each atom in a molecule. The molecules that contained Pb and S, I didn't know how to figure it out. If there's no shortcut rule that I can follow, I can just draw the molecule and find out the oxidation state of the atom in the molecule. But when the molecule is big, and contains more than one atom that there's no shortcut for, I don't know what to do. I can't draw it, because I can't figure out what atoms attach to the other atoms.
 
Pb is either +2 or +4. As I wrote earlier - in the case of larger molecules they are usually built of ready "blocks" - like sulfate anion, nitrate anion and so on. These have always the same composition and the same charge.
 

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