Energy quantization of the particle in a box

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of energy quantization in quantum mechanics, specifically in the context of the particle in a box model as presented in Shankar's "Principles of Quantum Mechanics." Participants explore the mathematical formulation and implications of Schrödinger's equation, particularly regarding the conditions for acceptable energy eigenfunctions.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion regarding the integration of Schrödinger's equation and the meaning of "overall scale" in the context of energy eigenfunctions.
  • Another participant suggests that the "overall scale" refers to the fact that any constant multiple of a solution to Schrödinger's equation is also a solution, allowing flexibility in choosing initial conditions.
  • A third participant elaborates on the mathematical structure of Schrödinger's equation, indicating that the function depends on multiple variables, including energy and initial conditions.
  • It is noted that for almost all values of the derivative at a point, the wave function diverges, except for a specific value that leads to acceptable eigenfunctions.
  • Participants discuss the numerical methods for solving Schrödinger's equation and the iterative process to find energy eigenvalues.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying levels of understanding regarding the mathematical details and implications of the energy quantization process. There is no consensus on the clarity of the explanation provided in Shankar's text, and multiple interpretations of the "overall scale" and the integration process are presented.

Contextual Notes

Some participants highlight the assumption that others are familiar with numerical integration and the prior content covered in the book, which may affect their understanding of the current discussion.

bodyscripter
Messages
1
Reaction score
0
I'm self-learning quantum mechanics and I'm reading the famous Shankar book (Principles of Quantum Mechanics - second edittion). At page 161 of the book, I don't understand the following part of this page:

"Let us restate the origin of energy quantization in another way. Consider the search for acceptable energy eigen-functions, taking the finite well as an example. If we start with some arbitrary values ##\psi(x_0)## and ##\psi'(x_0)##, at some point ##x_0## to the right of the well, we can integrate Schrödinger's equation numerically. (Recall the analogy with the problem of finding the trajectory of a particle given its initial position and velocity and the force on it.) As we integrate out to ##x \to \infty##, ##\psi## will surely blow up since ##\psi_{III}## contains a growing exponential. Since ##\psi(x_0)## merely fixes the overall scale, we vary ##\psi'(x_0)## until the growing exponential is killed. [Since we can solve problem analytically in region III, we can even say what the desired value of ##\psi'(x_0)## is: it is given by ##\psi'(x_0) = -\kappa \psi(x_0)##. Verify, starting with Eq. (5.2.4), that this implies ##B=0##.] We are now out of the fix as ##x \to \infty##, but we are committed to whatever comes out as we integrate to the left of ##x_0##. We will find that ##\psi## grows exponential till we reach the well, whereupon it will oscillate. When we cross the well, ##\psi## will again start to grow exponentially, for ##\psi_I## also contains a growing exponentially in general. Thus there will be no acceptable solution at some randomly chosen energy. It can, however, happen that for certain values of energy, ##\psi## will be exponentially damped in both regions I and III. [At any point ##x_0'## in region I, there is a ratio ##\psi'(x_0')/\psi(x_0')## for which only the damped exponential survives. The ##\psi## we get integrating from region III will not generally have this feature. At special energies, however, this can happen.] These are the allowed energies and the corresponding functions are the allowed eigen-functions. Having found them, we can choose ##\psi(x_0)## such that they are normalized to unity. For a nice numerical analysis of this problem see the book by Eisberg and Resnick.$".

I need the formula details to understand it. Another question: "overall scale", what does it mean?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
I can't follow it either - maybe with work but not easily.

However I can point you to a series of lectures that does carefully explain what's going on and much more besides:


Thanks
Bill
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: eloheim
bodyscripter said:
I need the formula details to understand it. Another question: "overall scale", what does it mean?

The "formula" is just the time-independent Schrödinger's equation for the infinite square well potential. It will have been covered somewhere in previous 160-odd pages. There is also an assumption here that you know what numerical integration is; you don't have to actually do it, but you have to know what it is.

The bit about "overall scale" is just referring to the fact that if ##\psi## is a solution to Schrödinger's equation, then any constant multiple of ##\psi## is also a solution. Thus we can choose ##\psi## to have any value we please at any single point without losing any generality. We then work from there to find the ##\psi## and ##\psi'## that when numerically integrated give us the desired declining exponential on both sides of the well. That's an unnormalized eigenfunction, but as a final step we can multiply it by whatever constant is necessary to normalize it.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: bodyscripter
bodyscripter said:
I need the formula details to understand it. Another question: "overall scale", what does it mean?

To answer the last question first, Schrödinger's equation for an energy eigenstate is:

[itex](\frac{-\hbar^2}{2m} \frac{\partial^2}{\partial x^2} + V(x)) \psi(x) = E \psi(x)[/itex]

Obviously, if [itex]\psi(x)[/itex] solves this equation, then so does [itex]\tilde{\psi}(x) \equiv C \psi(x)[/itex] for any constant [itex]C[/itex]. So we can choose [itex]\psi(x_0)[/itex] to be anything at all, and solve the equation, then at the end, we can multiply by a constant [itex]C[/itex] to make [itex]\int |\psi(x)|^2 dx = 1[/itex]. So he's just saying it doesn't matter what choice we make for [itex]\psi(x_0)[/itex].

As far as the details for his claim, I'm not sure what extra details you want. Mathematically, Schrödinger's equation implicitly gives a function [itex]\psi(x) = F(x,E,x_0, \psi_0,\psi'_0)[/itex] that depends on 5 quantities: (1) [itex]x[/itex], of course, (2) the energy [itex]E[/itex], (3) [itex]x_0[/itex], your starting point, (4) [itex]\psi_0 \equiv \psi(x_0)[/itex], the value at [itex]x=x_0[/itex], and (5) [itex]\psi'_0[/itex], the value of [itex]\psi'[/itex] at [itex]x=x_0[/itex]. Let's hold [itex]\psi_0[/itex] and [itex]x_0[/itex] fixed, so we get a function of three arguments: [itex]\psi(x) = F(x,E,\psi'_0)[/itex]. There are various ways to compute [itex]F[/itex], either numerically or in a power series.

Now, the first claim being made is that for almost all values of [itex]\psi'_0[/itex], [itex]lim_{x \rightarrow \infty} F(x,E,\psi'_0) = \infty[/itex]. Only for one very specific value of [itex]\psi'_0[/itex] will it be the case that [itex]lim_{x \rightarrow \infty} F(x,E,\psi'_0) = 0[/itex]. The author claims that that value is [itex]\psi'_0 = -\kappa \psi_0[/itex]. So let's pick that value for [itex]\psi'_0[/itex]

The second claim being made is that for almost all values of [itex]E[/itex], if [itex]\psi'_0 = -\kappa \psi_0[/itex], then [itex]lim_{x \rightarrow -\infty} F(x,E,\psi'_0) = \infty[/itex]. An energy eigenvalue is some value of [itex]E[/itex] such that [itex]lim_{x \rightarrow -\infty} F(x,E,\psi'_0) = 0[/itex] when [itex]\psi'_0 = -\kappa \psi_0[/itex].

So if you are solving the Schrödinger equation numerically, then you could do it this way:
  1. Fix [itex]x_0[/itex] and [itex]\psi_0[/itex]
  2. Make a guess for a starting value for [itex]E[/itex]
  3. Make a guess for a starting value for [itex]\psi'_0[/itex]
  4. Check if [itex]F(x,E,\psi'_0)[/itex] blows up for [itex]x[/itex] large and positive.
  5. If so, adjust [itex]\psi'_0[/itex] and go back to 4.
  6. If not, then check if [itex]F(x,E,\psi'_0)[/itex] blows up for [itex]x[/itex] large and negative.
  7. If so, adjust [itex]E[/itex] and go back to 3.
  8. If not, then you've found an approximate eigenvalue.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: bodyscripter and vanhees71

Similar threads

  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 21 ·
Replies
21
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 22 ·
Replies
22
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
1K
  • · Replies 60 ·
3
Replies
60
Views
8K