Epsilon-Delta Limits: Finding the Optimal Delta for a Given Epsilon Value

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around finding the optimal delta (δ) for a given epsilon (ε) in the context of the limit of (sin x)/x as x approaches 0. Participants are exploring the conditions under which the limit holds true and how to express these conditions mathematically.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster attempts to establish a relationship between δ and ε through inequalities involving the limit expression. Some participants question the clarity of the problem statement regarding the definition of "δ between zero and c is good." Others suggest reformulating the inequalities to better understand the bounds on δ.

Discussion Status

Participants are actively engaging with the problem, with some providing clarifications and alternative approaches. There is acknowledgment of the need to refine the inequalities used to express the relationship between δ and ε. While some progress has been made, there is no explicit consensus on the final approach to determine the optimal δ.

Contextual Notes

There are indications of confusion regarding the bounds and conditions for δ, as well as the implications of the inequalities used in the discussion. Participants are also considering the possibility of using numerical methods to find solutions.

ƒ(x)
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Given: limit of (sin x)/x as x --> 0 and that ε = .01
Problem: Find the greatest c such that δ between zero and c is good. Give an approximation to three decimal places.

Equations:

0 < |x - a| < δ
0 < |f(x) - L| < εAttempt:

0 < |x - 0| < δ
0 < | sin(x)/x - 1| < ε

0 < | sin(x)/x - 1| < .01
0 < | sin(x)/x| < 1.01
0 < |sin(x)| < 1.01|x|
0 < |sin(x)| < 1.01δ
0 < |sin(x)|/1.01 < δ
Since sin(x) is going to range between -1 and 1, the greatest value for δ is 1/1.01. But, this answer isn't correct. The correct answer is .245, and I don't know how to get that.
 
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ƒ(x) said:
Given: limit of (sin x)/x as x --> 0 and that ε = .01
Problem: Find the greatest c such that δ between zero and c is good. Give an approximation to three decimal places.

What do you mean by "δ between zero and c is good"?

My guess is that you mean:

"Find the greatest [itex]c[/itex] such that

[tex]\left|\frac{\sin x}{x} - 1 \right| < \epsilon[/tex]

whenever

[tex]0 < |x - 0| < \delta \leq c[/tex]."

Is that right?

[It seems clearer to dispense with [itex]c[/itex] and simply ask "how big can [itex]\delta[/itex] be?"]

Your problem is the following step:

Equations:

0 < | sin(x)/x - 1| < .01
0 < | sin(x)/x| < 1.01

While the upper bound in the second line is true, it doesn't buy you anything. In fact, it's true no matter what [itex]\epsilon[/itex] is, because [tex]|\sin(x)/x|[/tex] never exceeds 1.

Also, the lower bounds are wrong: both [tex]|\sin(x)/x - 1|[/tex] and [tex]|\sin(x)/x|[/tex] do equal 0 for some values of [itex]x[/itex]. We don't want/need to disallow that possibility.

Try writing

[tex]\left|\frac{\sin x}{x} - 1\right| < 0.01[/tex]

in the following equivalent way

[tex]-0.01 < \frac{\sin x}{x} - 1 < 0.01[/tex]

and thus

[tex]0.99 < \frac{\sin x}{x} < 1.01[/tex]

The right-hand inequality is true for all [itex]x[/itex], so we only need to consider the left inequality:

[tex]0.99 < \frac{\sin x}{x}[/tex]

Now you need to find what range of [itex]x[/itex] satisfies this inequality. I assume you are permitted to do so numerically (using a computer or calculator)?
 
Yes, that works. Thank you.
 
Oops, for the record, I just noticed that I lied when I said that [tex]|\sin(x)/x - 1|[/tex] can equal 0. It can't. But my point that you don't need the [tex]0 < |\sin(x)/x - 1|[/tex] part of the inequality is still correct.
 
Ok. :)
 

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