Excess Energy Saving from a constant energy source.

In summary, the conversation discusses the issue of frequent power cuts in Lebanon and the use of neighborhood power generators to provide electricity during these times. The owners of these generators charge a monthly fee for a certain subscription, regardless of the amount of energy used. The conversation then delves into the possibility of using the remainder of the subscription to store energy for later use, particularly for running appliances such as a washing machine or AC unit. However, this plan involves connecting a battery and a DC to AC inverter to the same line as the generator, which can be dangerous and potentially cause a catastrophic failure. The conversation also mentions the option of using an off-grid inverter to switch between using the grid and the battery, but this may be expensive.
  • #1
A Chamas
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Hello everyone.
So i live in Lebanon, and since a long time now we have constant power cuts, almost half the day each day. For that the Lebanese made up a system in which each neighborhood has power generators providing electricity to the residents when the power is out. Usually the owners of these generators would charge an average of 100$/month for a 5A/220V AC subscription. You'd have circuit breakers on the street for 5A or 10A depending on the subscription, so it doesn't matter how much energy you use, you will have to pay the same, usually i use 2.5A on average and the excess energy goes as extra profit for the owner of the generator. My question is, how would it be possible to use the remainder of the 5A perhaps to store the energy when not needed and then when energy is needed to go beyond the 5A limitation.
 
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  • #2
A Chamas said:
Hello everyone.
So i live in Lebanon, and since a long time now we have constant power cuts, almost half the day each day. For that the Lebanese made up a system in which each neighborhood has power generators providing electricity to the residents when the power is out. Usually the owners of these generators would charge an average of 100$/month for a 5A/220V AC subscription. You'd have circuit breakers on the street for 5A or 10A depending on the subscription, so it doesn't matter how much energy you use, you will have to pay the same, usually i use 2.5A on average and the excess energy goes as extra profit for the owner of the generator. My question is, how would it be possible to use the remainder of the 5A perhaps to store the energy when not needed and then when energy is needed to go beyond the 5A limitation.
2.5A at 220v is 550 watts of energy on average you want to store. 550 watts for 12 hours a day is 6.6 kwh of energy. Battery prices vary, but it should cost you more than $150 to store a kwh. Battery life varies on numerous factors such as how much you cycle them so that is something you need to pay attention to. The electronics needed might be difficult and/or expensive. I googled it and found a person who seems to be offering a kit that might do what you want, but they are asking 3,000 euros for a 5kwh kit.
http://www.diyesskit.com/
Good luck.
 
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  • #3
Thank you Evanish for your feedback. I think that this is a good starting point. But i have to give further precision. The power outage lasts 6 hours followed by 6 hours of electricity (around 15A breaker), so there will be no need for a big battery bank, a small battery bank capable of producing 2-3 Amps on top of the 5 A for a couple of hours enough to run the washing machine, a dryer or 1 AC unit would be ideal. My question is let's say i get a battery and a DC to AC inverter how should i wire it in a way, that the inverter would only send the right amount of electricity on the same line as the generator is it even possible i mean can i put 2 sources of AC current on the same line or would i get a catasrophic failure since they the current might be out of sync and u get one in the positive phase while the other in the negative phase.
 
  • #4
A Chamas said:
so there will be no need for a big battery bank, a small battery bank capable of producing 2-3 Amps on top of the 5 A for a couple of hours enough to run the washing machine, a dryer or 1 AC unit would be ideal. My question is let's say i get a battery and a DC to AC inverter how should i wire it in a way, that the inverter would only send the right amount of electricity on the same line as the generator is it even possible i mean can i put 2 sources of AC current on the same line or would i get a catasrophic failure since they the current might be out of sync and u get one in the positive phase while the other in the negative phase.
You are asking for help to do some seriously dangerous stuff ... I would STRONGLY advise you to reconsider your plans
and keep the 2 systems separate. You are also underestimating the power requirements of a washer, a drier or AC unit
and a battery's ability to provide useful power for any length of timeDave
 
  • #5
A Chamas said:
Thank you Evanish for your feedback. I think that this is a good starting point. But i have to give further precision. The power outage lasts 6 hours followed by 6 hours of electricity (around 15A breaker), so there will be no need for a big battery bank, a small battery bank capable of producing 2-3 Amps on top of the 5 A for a couple of hours enough to run the washing machine, a dryer or 1 AC unit would be ideal. My question is let's say i get a battery and a DC to AC inverter how should i wire it in a way, that the inverter would only send the right amount of electricity on the same line as the generator is it even possible i mean can i put 2 sources of AC current on the same line or would i get a catasrophic failure since they the current might be out of sync and u get one in the positive phase while the other in the negative phase.
Perhaps you would benefit from something called an off-grid inverter. Charge the batteries when the gird is up, switch over to the off-grid inverter when it's down. I haven't researched them enough to know if they will meet you need, but it's something you might want to look into although I think it's pretty expensive.
off-grid-solar-system.png

http://energyinformative.org/grid-tied-off-grid-and-hybrid-solar-systems/

Here is something else that might interest you.
http://electronics.stackexchange.co...esel-generator-with-a-pure-sine-wave-inverter
 
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  • #6
A Chamas said:
a dryer or 1 AC unit

Unless those are gas appliances, they are LARGE loads not practical for a battery.
Here in US $300 will buy a 3kw gasoline generator. Even that's not enough for an electric dryer but it'd run a small A/C .
If your dryer is propane or natural gas fired then you only need maybe ½kw for the motor.
 
  • #7
Thread closed for Moderation...
 
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  • #8
@A Chamas -- You will only be able to run your major appliances when the AC Mains power is on. It is impractical for you to store enough energy to run them when the AC Mains power is off. You can charge 12V batteries when the AC Mains power is on, and use that 12V battery power later for small loads like a fan and a reading light and a radio and small portable TV. You could also add a solar panel and 12V power converter to help you when the power is out and the sunshine is strong.

This thread will remain closed due to the inexperience of the OP and the dangers of such people trying to do DIY AC Mains projects.
 
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1. What is excess energy saving?

Excess energy saving refers to the reduction in energy consumption beyond what is required for a specific task or process. It occurs when a constant energy source, such as electricity or fuel, is used in a more efficient manner, resulting in a surplus of saved energy.

2. How does a constant energy source contribute to excess energy saving?

A constant energy source, such as solar power or wind energy, provides a reliable and consistent supply of energy, allowing for more precise and efficient energy usage. This can lead to excess energy saving as the energy source is not being wasted or overused.

3. What are the benefits of excess energy saving from a constant energy source?

The benefits of excess energy saving from a constant energy source include reduced energy costs, decreased environmental impact, and increased energy independence. It also promotes sustainable energy practices and conservation of natural resources.

4. Can excess energy saving be achieved with all types of constant energy sources?

Yes, excess energy saving can be achieved with various constant energy sources, including renewable sources like solar, wind, hydro, and geothermal energy, as well as non-renewable sources like fossil fuels. The key is using these energy sources efficiently and minimizing waste.

5. How can individuals and businesses contribute to excess energy saving from a constant energy source?

Individuals and businesses can contribute to excess energy saving by implementing energy-efficient practices, such as using energy-saving appliances, turning off lights and electronics when not in use, and utilizing renewable energy sources. They can also support policies and initiatives that promote sustainable energy practices and conservation efforts.

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