Finding the exact length of the curve (II)

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around finding the exact length of the curve defined by the equation \( y = 1 + 6x^{\frac{3}{2}} \) over the interval \( 0 \le x \le 1 \). Participants explore the integration process involved in calculating the length and address potential errors in the mathematical manipulation of the integrals.

Discussion Character

  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant proposes the integral \( \int ^1_0 \sqrt{1 + (9\sqrt{x})^2} \, dx \) can be simplified to \( \int^1_0 1 + 9\sqrt{x} \, dx \), leading to a calculation of the curve length as \( 7 \).
  • Another participant questions the validity of the simplification, stating that \( \sqrt{1 + 81x} \ne 1 + 9\sqrt{x} \), indicating a potential error in the proposed solution.
  • Further clarification is sought regarding the meaning of the symbol \( \ne \) and its application to the mathematical expressions discussed.
  • It is emphasized that the property \( \sqrt{a+b} \ne \sqrt{a} + \sqrt{b} \) holds true, which is relevant to the earlier claims about the integrals.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express disagreement regarding the simplification of the integral. There is no consensus on the validity of the proposed solution, and the discussion remains unresolved with competing views on the mathematical manipulation involved.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights the importance of correctly applying mathematical properties, particularly in the context of square roots and integrals. There are unresolved points regarding the assumptions made in the simplification process.

shamieh
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Find the exact length of the curve

$0 \le x \le 1$

$$y = 1 + 6x^{\frac{3}{2}}$$ <-- If you can't read this, the exponent is $$\frac{3}{2}$$

$$
\therefore y' = 9\sqrt{x}$$

$$\int ^1_0 \sqrt{1 + (9\sqrt{x})^2} \, dx$$

$$= \int ^1_0 \sqrt{1 + 81x} \, dx$$

$$
= \int^1_0 1 + 9\sqrt{x} \, dx$$

Now can't I just split the two integrals separately to obtain:

$$x + 6x^{\frac{3}{2}} |^1_0 $$ <-- If you can't read this, the exponent is $$\frac{3}{2}$$

Thus getting: $$1 + 6 = 7? $$
 
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shamieh said:
Find the exact length of the curve

$$y = 1 + 6x^{\frac{3}{2}}$$ <-- If you can't read this, the exponent is $$\frac{3}{2}$$

$$
\therefore y' = 9\sqrt{x}$$

$$\int ^1_0 \sqrt{1 + (9\sqrt{x})^2} \, dx$$

$$= \int ^1_0 \sqrt{1 + 81x} \, dx$$

$$
= \int^1_0 1 + 9\sqrt{x} \, dx$$

Now can't I just split the two integrals separately to obtain:

$$x + 6x^{\frac{3}{2}} |^1_0 $$ <-- If you can't read this, the exponent is $$\frac{3}{2}$$

Thus getting: $$1 + 6 = 7? $$

There is a little questionable point because $\displaystyle \sqrt{1 + 81\ x} \ne 1 + 9\sqrt{x}$...

Kind regards

$\chi$ $\sigma$
 
chisigma said:
There is a little questionable point because $\displaystyle \sqrt{1 + 81\ x} \ne 1 + 9\sqrt{x}$...

Kind regards

$\chi$ $\sigma$

How is that $$\ne$$ ?

$$\sqrt{1} = 1$$ , $$\sqrt{81} = 9 $$, $$\sqrt{x} = \sqrt{x}$$
 
shamieh said:
How is that $$\ne$$ ?

$$\sqrt{1} = 1$$ , $$\sqrt{81} = 9 $$, $$\sqrt{x} = \sqrt{x}$$

The symbol $\ne$ means 'not equal to'...

Kind regards

$\chi$ $\sigma$
 
chisigma said:
The symbol $\ne$ means 'not equal to'...

Kind regards

$\chi$ $\sigma$

I understand what the symbol means, my question is tho, why is it $$\ne$$ to the solution i proposed... $$\sqrt{x}$$ is just itself still $$\sqrt{x}$$ all we did was square x to make it $$\sqrt{x}$$ . How can you say that x square rooted isn't = to $$\sqrt{x}$$

What am I not seeing here?

because if we have x then decide to square root x , we will just end up with $$\sqrt{x}$$
 
What I meant to say is that You wrote something like...

$\displaystyle \int_{0}^{1} \sqrt{1 + 81\ x}\ dx = \int_{0}^{1} (1 + 9\ \sqrt{x})\ dx\ (1)$

... but it isn't true because [as You can easily verify...] for $0 < x \le 1$ is...

$\displaystyle \sqrt{1 + 81\ x} \ne 1 + 9\ \sqrt{x}\ (2)$

Kind regards

$\chi$ $\sigma$
 
... in other words, it is NOT TRUE that $\sqrt{a+b} = \sqrt a + \sqrt b$.
 

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