Fire Hose Power Output, Given Height and Radius of Hose

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Homework Help Overview

The problem involves calculating the minimum power required for a fire hose to project water to a height of 34 meters, given the diameter of the hose and the mass of the water. The context is within fluid dynamics and energy conservation principles.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the necessary velocity for the water to reach the specified height and explore the relationship between kinetic energy and potential energy. There are attempts to calculate mass flow rates and power based on these velocities.

Discussion Status

Participants are actively engaging with the problem, providing calculations and questioning the meaning of certain operations. Some guidance has been offered regarding the relationship between kinetic energy and mass flow rates, but no consensus has been reached on the final approach.

Contextual Notes

There is a discussion about the assumptions related to the behavior of water as it ascends and the implications of treating it as a solid column versus a flowing fluid. Participants also note the importance of energy density in the calculations.

yellowcakepie

Homework Statement


A fire hose for use in urban areas must be able to shoot a stream of water to a maximum height of 34 m. The water leaves the hose at ground level in a circular stream 4.0 cm in diameter.

What minimum power is required to create such a stream of water? Every cubic meter of water has a mass of 1.00×10^3 kg.

Homework Equations


PE = mgh

r = 1/2d

A = πr^2

V = πr^2h = Ah

P = W/t = F*d/t = F*v

The Attempt at a Solution


I converted the 4.0 cm diameter to radius in terms of meters, which is r = 0.02 m.
I solved for A, and multiplied A by maximum height (h) to get volume (V) which is 0.0427 m^3 column of water that is 34 m tall.
I used the density of water, which is 1000 kg/m^3 to get the mass of the column, which is 42.7 kg.
I don't really know where to go from here. I used PE = (42.7 kg)(9.8 m/s^2)(34 m), but I know that it is wrong. I'm not sure how to integrate the height of the column of water (if that's needed).
 
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How fast does the water have to leave the hose to rise 34 meters?

You can use this velocity for two different aspects of a power calculation.
 
yellowcakepie said:
the mass of the column, which is 42.7 kg.
Water is not a solid. As it ascends it slows down, so the "column" must get broader. But again, since it is not a solid, it is not exerting that weight on anything, so finding its mass is not helpful.
Follow mfb's hint.
 
mfb said:
How fast does the water have to leave the hose to rise 34 meters?

You can use this velocity for two different aspects of a power calculation.

Okay so, I used the inital KE, which is 1/2mv^2 and set that equal to the PE at the maximum height, which is mgh.
Therefore v = 25.8 m/s after some algebra. I can use that for P = Fv.

I then need to get the mass flow rate per second out of the hose. I'll begin with the cross-sectional area of the hose. The cross-sectional area of the hose is A = pi * (0.02)^2 = 1.257*10^-3 m^2.

I then multiply that by v = 25.8 m/s to get the volume flow rate, so Av = 0.0324 m^3/s. I then can convert that to mass flow rate by dividing by the density of water, 1000 kg/m^3. Therefore, mass flow rate = 32.4 kg/s.

I can then multiply mass flow rate by g to get the force exerted per second to pump that amount of water out, and then by max height h to get power.

P = 32.4 kg/s * 9.8 m/s^2 * 34 m = 10796 W
 
yellowcakepie said:
I then multiply that by v = 25.8 m/s to get the volume flow rate, so Av = 0.0324 m^3/s. I then can convert that to mass flow rate by dividing by the density of water, 1000 kg/m^3. Therefore, mass flow rate = 32.4 kg/s.
Multiply, not divide, but you did it right to get the answer.
yellowcakepie said:
I can then multiply mass flow rate by g to get the force exerted per second to pump that amount of water out
I don't think that is a meaningful operation.

You can calculate the energy density (energy per mass) based on the velocity, and use that together with the mass flow.
 
mfb said:
I don't think that is a meaningful operation.

You can calculate the energy density (energy per mass) based on the velocity, and use that together with the mass flow.

I wasn't too clear on that when my instructor gave me the reasoning behind the operation. How is energy per mass calculated?
 
It is just the kinetic energy of the water. If you know the energy a mass m has, divide that by m to get the energy per mass.
 
mfb said:
It is just the kinetic energy of the water. If you know the energy a mass m has, divide that by m to get the energy per mass.

Oh so, that means in 1 second, there will be 32.4 kg of water. That 32.4 kg of water will have KE = 16.2*25.8^2 = 10783 J. But that much water is coming out per second, so 10783 J/s = 10783 W. Got it.
 

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