First order system DE -> second order

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around finding a second-order differential equation (DE) for a system described by two first-order equations involving variables x and y. The subject area includes differential equations and system dynamics.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Mathematical reasoning, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore different methods to eliminate one variable by substituting or differentiating the equations. Questions arise about whether to integrate or differentiate to achieve a second-order equation.

Discussion Status

Some participants have offered guidance on how to manipulate the equations, suggesting substitution and differentiation as potential approaches. There is an ongoing exploration of the implications of these methods, with no explicit consensus reached on the correctness of the derived forms.

Contextual Notes

Participants express uncertainty about the transition from first-order to second-order equations, indicating a possible lack of familiarity with the concepts outside of specific examples discussed in class.

tourjete
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first order system DE --> second order

Homework Statement



Find a second-order DE for x alone that is equivalent to this system.


Homework Equations



dx/dt = 2x-y

dy/dt = -x

The Attempt at a Solution



I honestly have no clue where to start; in class we pretty much only stuck to springs when discussing second order equations.

Do I have to integrate the two given equations with respect to t so I have the t's in the equation? Or should I differentiate so I have a second derivative and hence a second order equation?
 
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It's not that complicated. For example, just solve the second equation for x and substitute that into the first equation.
 


You can differentiate the first equation and then use the 2nd to eliminate y.
 


Thanks guys! I did what fzero sugested and just want to make sure I did it right. I solved the second equation for y so I could eliminate it from the other one and got y = -xt.

I then plugged that into the first equation to get dx/dt = 2x + xt + C. Differentiating with respect to t i gotthat the second derivative is x + C. Is this right? It seems simplistic given the derivatves that were given.
 


What I meant was take the derivative of the first equation to get

\frac{d^2x}{dt^2} = 2\frac{dx}{dt}-\frac{dy}{dt},

then use the 2nd to write this as

\frac{d^2x}{dt^2} = 2\frac{dx}{dt}+x.
 

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