Frobenius Method When Initial Value of A Sum is not 1

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Homework Help Overview

The problem involves solving a second-order linear differential equation using the Frobenius method. The equation presented is \(36x^2y''+(5-9x^2)y=0\), and the original poster is attempting to find a series solution in the form of a power series.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster substitutes the series expansions for \(y\) and \(y''\) into the differential equation and expresses the terms in a common form. They express confusion regarding the starting index of the sums and how to handle the resulting indicial equation. Participants discuss the implications of pulling out terms from the series and the conditions under which coefficients can be assumed to be zero.

Discussion Status

Participants are actively engaging with the original poster's reasoning, questioning the treatment of coefficients and the implications of the indicial equation. There is an exploration of the conditions under which certain coefficients can be assumed to be zero, and the discussion is focused on clarifying these points without reaching a definitive conclusion.

Contextual Notes

The original poster expresses uncertainty about the application of the Frobenius method to other types of differential equations, such as Legendre and Bessel equations, indicating a broader context of study. There is also mention of textbook references regarding the assumptions made about the coefficients in the series expansion.

PatsyTy
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Homework Statement


Solve

\begin{equation*}
36x^2y''+(5-9x^2)y=0
\end{equation*}

using the Frobenius method

Homework Equations



Assume a solution of the form

\begin{equation*}
y=\sum_{n=0}^{\infty}{a_nx^{n+s}}
\end{equation*}

then

\begin{equation*}
y''=\sum_{n=0}^{\infty}{(n+s)(n+s-1)a_nx^{n+s-2}}
\end{equation*}

The Attempt at a Solution



I substitute the expanded forms of ##y## and ##y''## into the D.E

\begin{equation*}
36x^2 \sum_{n=0}^{\infty}{(n+s)(n+s-1)a_nx^{n+s-2}}+5 \sum_{n=0}^{\infty}{a_nx^{n+s}} -9x^2 \sum_{n=0}^{\infty}{a_nx^{n+s}} =0
\end{equation*}

and put the terms of ##x## into the sums

\begin{equation*}
36 \sum_{n=0}^{\infty}{(n+s)(n+s-1)a_nx^{n+s}}+5 \sum_{n=0}^{\infty}{a_nx^{n+s}} -9\sum_{n=0}^{\infty}{a_nx^{n+s+2}} =0
\end{equation*}

I then modify the last term so that the ##x## factor is ##x^{n+s}##

\begin{equation*}
36 \sum_{n=0}^{\infty}{(n+s)(n+s-1)a_nx^{n+s}}+5 \sum_{n=0}^{\infty}{a_nx^{n+s}} -9\sum_{n=2}^{\infty}{a_{n-2}x^{n+s}} =0
\end{equation*}

This is where I get confused, the last term starts at ##n=2##, all the examples I have seen have their highest starting value for a sum equal to ##n=1##, in those cases I would comine the terms with the sum starting at ##n=0## and take out the first term of ##n=0## resulting in the indicial equation multiplied by ##a_o## which I would use to solve the D.E. Now however I have an extra term, just to be clear below is how I have found the indicial equation:

\begin{equation*}
\sum_{n=0}^{\infty}{[36(n+s)(n+s-1)+5]a_nx^{n+s}}-9\sum_{n=2}^{\infty}{a_{n-2}x^{n+s}}=0 \\
[36(s)(s-1)+5]a_0x^s+\sum_{n=1}^{\infty}{[36(n+s)(n+s-1)+5]a_nx^{n+s}}-9\sum_{n=2}^{\infty}{a_{n-2}x^{n+s}}=0
\end{equation*}

So I have my indicial equation but I can't combine the second and third terms together because their initial values don't match. I'm not sure if I should pull out the ##n=1## term on the second term so I can create a recursion relation to use however I am not sure what to do with that term I pull out.

Also a somewhat unrelated question, in this course we are also working with the Legendre D.Es and Bessel's equations, would I be able to solve both of these using the forbenius method? Or do I need some other techniques?

Any help would be appreciated!
 
Last edited:
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PatsyTy said:
I'm not sure if I should pull out the n=1 term on the second term so I can create a recursion relation to use
Yes.
PatsyTy said:
I am not sure what to do with that term I pull out.
What would you do with the n=0 term?
 
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haruspex said:
Yes.

What would you do with the n=0 term?

Thanks for the reply. For the n=0 term since we can't assume ##a_0=0## then we have to find a value for ##s## that eliminates the ##a_0## term. I get ##s=\frac{5}{6}## and ##s=\frac{1}{6}##. I assume then I would do the same for the ##n=1## term. Below I have my equation with the ##n=1## taken out

\begin{equation*}
(36s(s-1)+5)a_0x^s+(36s(s+1)+5)a_1x^{s+1}+\sum_{n=2}^{\infty}{\big[(36(n+s)(n+s-1)+5)a_nx^{n+s}-9a_{n-2}x^{n+s}\big]}
\end{equation*}

Thinking about this wouldn't this mean that the only possible values for ##s## would be common roots of the ##n=0## term and the ##n=1## term? This is the only way we could garuntee that the terms including ##a_0## and ##a_1## would equal zero. The issue now is I don't have a common ##s## value for the ##n=0## and ##n=1## terms. For ##n=0## I have ##s=\frac{5}{6}## and ##s=\frac{1}{6}## and for ##n=1## I have ##s=-\frac{5}{6}## and ##s=-\frac{1}{6}##. Does this mean I have made an error somewhere in my calculation or is there something I don't understand?
 
PatsyTy said:
For the n=0 term since we can't assume ##a_0=0##
Right, because of the way s is defined.
PatsyTy said:
I assume then I would do the same for the ##n=1## term.
Why would the same restriction apply to that term?
 
haruspex said:
Right, because of the way s is defined.

Why would the same restriction apply to that term?

I didn't write it out in the equation above but that entire equation equals zero. From my understanding all the ##a_n## terms are unknown constants so the only way we can garuntee that this equation equals zero is if the ##s## portion of the terms equals zero.

Or do we define ##a_0## as zero and for any other ##a_n## where ##n>0## we can choose if it equals zero? Is there somewhere else in the equations that indicates that ##a_1## is zero? Would finding the recursion relations using ##s=\frac{5}{6}## and ##s={1}{6}## give an ##a_1=0## maybe? I'll try this out in the morning if it would help.

Reading my textbook it mentions that since ##a_0x^s## is the first term in the series we assume it is not zero but it doesn't say why, is there somewhere I could read up on why?

Sorry for all the questions, seems like once I figure something out five more questions arise.

Thanks again for the help, I really appreciate it.
 
PatsyTy said:
I didn't write it out in the equation above but that entire equation equals zero. From my understanding all the ##a_n## terms are unknown constants so the only way we can garuntee that this equation equals zero is if the ##s## portion of the terms equals zero.

Or do we define ##a_0## as zero and for any other ##a_n## where ##n>0## we can choose if it equals zero? Is there somewhere else in the equations that indicates that ##a_1## is zero? Would finding the recursion relations using ##s=\frac{5}{6}## and ##s={1}{6}## give an ##a_1=0## maybe? I'll try this out in the morning if it would help.

Reading my textbook it mentions that since ##a_0x^s## is the first term in the series we assume it is not zero but it doesn't say why, is there somewhere I could read up on why?

Sorry for all the questions, seems like once I figure something out five more questions arise.

Thanks again for the help, I really appreciate it.
In the assumed form of the equation, s is defined to be the lowest power with a nonzero coefficient. Hence a0 is not zero. But any other coefficient can be zero.
 

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