Function notation for the derivative operator

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the representation of the derivative operator using different notations, specifically Lagrange's prime notation and Leibniz's notation. Participants explore how to express the derivative of a function in arrow notation and the implications of different notational choices in various contexts, including engineering and programming.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants express a preference for Lagrange's prime notation for its compactness compared to Leibniz's notation.
  • There is a discussion about the correct way to express the derivative operator in arrow notation, with some suggesting that the mappings proposed initially are incorrect.
  • One participant argues that the derivative of a constant function evaluated at a point results in zero, challenging the validity of certain mappings.
  • Another participant suggests that using Leibniz's notation can become cumbersome, particularly when trying to express evaluations at specific points.
  • Alternative notations for differentiation, such as using a simple D for single-variable functions and D_k for partial differentiation, are introduced as potentially more convenient options.
  • There is a mention of the importance of knowing various notations to switch to the most suitable form for a given situation.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the best notation for expressing derivatives, with multiple competing views on the utility and clarity of different notational systems remaining evident throughout the discussion.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the limitations of certain notations, particularly in terms of clarity when evaluating derivatives at specific points versus taking derivatives of constant functions.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for students and professionals in mathematics, engineering, and related fields who are navigating different notational systems for derivatives and their implications in various applications.

cra18
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If we have the function
<br /> f : x \mapsto f(x) = 3x^2,<br />
I am used to Lagrange's prime notation for the derivative:
<br /> f&#039; : x \mapsto f&#039;(x) = 6x.<br />
I'm fond of this notation. But it has been mostly abandoned in my engineering courses in favor of Leibniz's notation, using differential operators such as \frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}x} per the above. I want to express the same relation as the second equation above using Leibniz's notation, but am having a lot of trouble. In particular, I understand that the derivative operator is a function that maps from a set of functions to a set of functions, so if
<br /> \frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}x} : f \mapsto \frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}x}f<br />
is true, then it seems correct (to me) to write
<br /> \frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}x}f : a \mapsto \frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}x}f(a),<br />
but I've been told that in order to show that a differentiated function is evaluated at some arbitrary point such as a, it is necessary to write something like
<br /> \frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}x}f(x)\vert_{x=a},<br />
which means that the mappings as I have them are not correct, and it would be more correct to write something like
<br /> \frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}x} : f(x) \mapsto \frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}x}f(x)<br />
and
<br /> \frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}x}f(x) : a \mapsto \frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}x}f(x)\vert_{x=a}.<br />

Any help would be greatly appreciated; I'm starting to confuse myself. I am just trying to express the derivative of a function using Leibniz's notation in arrow notation.
 
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cra18 said:
If we have the function
<br /> f : x \mapsto f(x) = 3x^2,<br />
I am used to Lagrange's prime notation for the derivative:
<br /> f&#039; : x \mapsto f&#039;(x) = 6x.<br />
I'm fond of this notation. But it has been mostly abandoned in my engineering courses in favor of Leibniz's notation, using differential operators such as \frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}x} per the above.
That's difficult to believe. Prime notation is usually more compact than Leibniz notation, if somewhat less explicit, and engineers tend to strive for efficiency.
cra18 said:
I want to express the same relation as the second equation above using Leibniz's notation, but am having a lot of trouble. In particular, I understand that the derivative operator is a function that maps from a set of functions to a set of functions, so if
<br /> \frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}x} : f \mapsto \frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}x}f<br />
is true, then it seems correct (to me) to write
<br /> \frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}x}f : a \mapsto \frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}x}f(a),<br />
No, this isn't correct, since d/dx(f(a)) = 0. f(a) is a constant, so its derivative is zero.
cra18 said:
but I've been told that in order to show that a differentiated function is evaluated at some arbitrary point such as a, it is necessary to write something like
<br /> \frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}x}f(x)\vert_{x=a},<br />
which means that the mappings as I have them are not correct, and it would be more correct to write something like
<br /> \frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}x} : f(x) \mapsto \frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}x}f(x)<br />
This seems very cumbersome.
cra18 said:
and
<br /> \frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}x}f(x) : a \mapsto \frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}x}f(x)\vert_{x=a}.<br />

Any help would be greatly appreciated; I'm starting to confuse myself. I am just trying to express the derivative of a function using Leibniz's notation in arrow notation.
 
You're right. It would have to be something like
<br /> \frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}x}f : a \mapsto \left(\frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}x}f\right)(a) = \frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}x}f(x)\vert_{x=a}.<br />
This is indeed extremely cumbersome, which is probably why I haven't been able to find an example doing this. I think I'll stick with the definition
<br /> f&#039; : x \mapsto f&#039;(x) = \frac{\mathrm{d}}{\mathrm{d}x}f(x),
though I hate mixing notation.

Thanks for your insight. And the reason why Leibniz notation is favored here is because of how easily linear operators can be implemented in Matlab or some such language using symbolic math packages.
 
Last edited:
There are other notations for the differentiation operator which aren't saddled with the cumbersome ##x## of ##d/dx##. For functions of a single variable, a simple ##D## is often used:
$$D : f \mapsto f'$$
This notation has the advantage that iteration of the operator can be conveniently indicated with an exponent:
$$D^n : f \mapsto f^{(n)}$$
For functions of multiple variables, one sometimes sees notation like ##D_k## to indicate partial differentiation with respect to the ##k##'th variable.
 
It is important to know all of the common notations, both because they are in common use and to switch to the form that best in a particular situation. We indicate the

$$\left( \dfrac{d }{dx} \right)^n f(x)=\dfrac{d^n }{dx^n} f(x)=\dfrac{d^n f(x)}{dx^n} = (f(x))^{(n)}=D^n f(x) =D_x^n f(x)$$
The trouble is that f(a) has derivative zero so we must indicate we want to take the derivative, then evaluate it. Not evaluate it, then take the derivative. Two ways to indicate this are to use the evaluation bar, or use the derivative notation without the variable and evaluate the indicated derivative
$$\left. \left( \dfrac{d }{dx} \right)^n f(x) \right| _{x=a}
=\left. \dfrac{d^n }{dx^n} f(x) \right| _{x=a}
=\left. \dfrac{d^n f(x)}{dx^n} \right| _{x=a}
= \left. (f(x))^{(n)} \right| _{x=a}
= \left. D^n f(x) \right| _{x=a}
= \left. D_x^n f(x) \right| _{x=a} \\ \\

\left( \left( \dfrac{d }{dx} \right)^n f \right) (a)
=\left( \dfrac{d^n }{dx^n} f \right) (a)
=\left( \dfrac{d^n f}{dx^n} \right) (a)
= f^{(n)} (a)
=(D^n f)(a) =(D_x^n f)(a)$$

in summary

$$D(f(x))=(D f)(x)=\dfrac{d}{dx} f(x) \\
(D f)(a)=\left. \dfrac{d}{dx} f(x) \right| _{x=a} \\
D(f(a))=\dfrac{d}{dx} f(a)=0$$
 
Thanks for all of the answers. And that was incredibly helpful lurflurf.
 

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