News George Carlin Dies at 71 | Celebrating a Lasting Legacy

[Ivan Seeking]

Cracking jokes is one thing, but most of the more 'serious' people that seem to be filled with hate and discrimination, are the religious fundamentalists themselves.

Yes, this has been my point about all of these types: They are antithetical to their own alleged philosophy. From my point of view, this guy has more in common with the Grand Wizard of the KKK, than he does Christian philosophy or beliefs. The essential message of Christinity is Love - love God, and love all other people, including your enemies. Any message to the contrary is by definition not a Christian message.

In very literal terms, many fundamentalists are in fact followers of the old Testament, which predates Christianity, and is, according to Christinity, null and void. So in spite of what they say to the contrary, their message does not meet the technical definition of Christianity. They are following the creed of Pre-Christians.

This is why, for example, as a Catholic kid, I wasn't taught that I would go to hell for shaving. And indeed, we see many well shaved Christians of all creeds.

 

[B. Elliott]

Yes, this has been my point about all of these types: They are antithetical to their own alleged philosophy. From my point of view, this guy has more in common with the Grand Wizard of the KKK, than Christian philosophy or beliefs. The essential message of Christinity is Love - love God, and love all other people, including your enemies. Any message that violates this message is, by definition, not a Christian message.

Excellent point. I also wish more religious people out there followed the school of thought.

 

[Cyrus]

Yes, this has been my point about all of these types: They are antithetical to their own alleged philosophy. From my point of view, this guy has more in common with the Grand Wizard of the KKK, than he does Christian philosophy or beliefs. The essential message of Christinity is Love - love God, and love all other people, including your enemies. Any message to the contrary is by definition not a Christian message.

In very literal terms, many fundamentalists are in fact followers of the old Testament, which predates Christianity, and is, according to Christinity, null and void. So in spite of what they say to the contrary, their message does not meet the technical definition of Christianity. They are following the creed of Pre-Christians.

This is why, for example, as a Catholic kid, I wasn't taught that I would go to hell for shaving. And indeed, we see many well shaved Christians of all creeds.

Ultimately though, then it becomes whose interpretation of religion is right. Yours, or mine? I say I am more christian than you. You say I am not a true christian. The argument is tautological.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Ultimately though, then it becomes whose interpretation of religion is right. Yours, or mine? I say I am more christian than you. You say I am not a true christian. The argument is tautological.

Actually, from a technical pov, I don't think that is true. It may be true if a person defines religion by his own preferences, but there are specific concepts that are either accepted or not. In other words, there are a million arguments to be made about interpretations of scripture, but there are still logical boundaries within any doctrine. Beyond that you can call a religion whatever you want - Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, or Voodoo for that matter - but that doesn't make it so. There is no way to logically justify the selling of hate within the context of Christianity. It is antithetical by definition. It may be that people have done this for centuries, but we find crackpots, power mongers, and hate mongers, in all walks of life.

I was listening to a few interviews with Carlin, and one thing that came out is that he wasn't really against the idea of an afterlife - a continuation of some kind - it seems that he just objected to the traditional old man with a beard.

Something else caught my ear as I have made the same argument. Loosely quoted, he asked why it is that when some UFO believer talks, people tend to laugh, but when a religious person talks, people tend to act with reverence. Which is the more likely of the two; UFOs [ET vehicles] or God?

 

[Cyrus]

Actually, from a technical pov, I don't think that is true. It may be true if a person defines religion by his own preferences, but there are specific concepts that are either accepted or not. In other words, there are a million arguments to be made about interpretations of scripture, but there are still logical boundaries within any doctrine. Beyond that you can call a religion whatever you want - Christianity, Islam, Hindu, or Voodoo - for that matter, but that doesn't make it so.

Sure its true. Catholic or Christian. Now, both a basically the 'same thing' but a Catholic and a Christian DONT believe in the same things. Its exactly all these variations that lead to different subsets of religions. Sunni v. Shiite. And ask both sides and they will both give you the same answer. THEY are the ones with the correct version. Its the OTHER guy that has bastardized the religion.

I was listening to a few interviews with Carlin, and one thing that came out is that he wasn't really against the idea of an afterlife - a continuation of some kind - it seems that he just objected to the traditional old man with a beard.

Well, I wouldn't be against the idea of an afterlife either. I don't think any sane person would be. But that does not mean there actually is one, or that there are religious conditions as to how that afterlife will be (Heaven or hell) based on how you live while alive. But without any form of proof of its existence, this is merely an idea.

Something else caught my ear as I have made the same argument. Loosely quoted, he asked why it is that when some UFO believer talks, people tend to laugh, but when a religious person talks, people tend to act with reverence. Which is the more likely of the two; UFOs [ET vehicles] or God?

I think that's a fair statement. Although, I think people should tend to laugh at both because most people claiming to see UFOs are quacks as well with no real proof of anything. I like how sagan addressed this in COSMOS, saying where is one single shred of evidence from all these UFO people?

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Sure its true. Catholic or Christian. Now, both a basically the 'same thing' but a Catholic and a Christian DONT believe in the same things.

Frankly, you are arguing nonsense. Catholics are Christians. You don't know what you're talking about. But I will say no more as this has gone farther than was intended.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christian_denominations

 

[Cyrus]

Frankly, you are arguing nonsense. Catholics are Christians. You don't know what you're talking about. But I will say no more as this has gone farther than was intended.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christian_denominations

Not really. Yeah, I know catholics are christians. I should have made that more clear. Perhaps the better word would have been denominations?

I'd like to know exactly what part of what I said you think is 'nonsense' though.