Godel's ITs & the Physical World: Is a ToE impossible?

[greswd]

Both Hawking and Dyson have said that Godel's incompleteness theorems prove that it is impossible for us to formulate an absolutely fundamental Theory of Everything.

Is that true? Do the theorems apply to the physical world as they apply to the realm of mathematics?

 

[DarkoDornel]

To be truthful, they are chasing rainbows in finding ToE...there is no such thing, to explain everything in the universe, you may explain this one, but others are different. That is the arrogance of humanity to be correct on this subject. There are many versions of mathematics in this physical world. Indeed we have discovered some areas of cosmology about the physics. The mathematics is one thing. We need to rethink existence before we learn about everything in universe.

 

[MacRudi]

Both Hawking and Dyson have said that Godel's incompleteness theorems prove that it is impossible for us to formulate an absolutely fundamental Theory of Everything.

Is that true? Do the theorems apply to the physical world as they apply to the realm of mathematics?

A very good question, I would have asked similar. Especially it is a very actual debate because in theoretical physics we try to prove one theory with another theory mathematically. (M theory for S Matrix)

 

[DarkoDornel]

M-theory is close, but to many million miles away from the theory. I believe we would be able to know our universe. But others no chance. String theory is other failure for ToE. There is a beautiful equation there, but something does not complete the reality. There is ways to marry GR with Quantum Theory.

 

[MacRudi]

M-theory is close, but to many million miles away from the theory. I believe we would be able to know our universe. But others no chance. String theory is other failure for ToE. There is a beautiful equation there, but something does not complete the reality. There is ways to marry GR with Quantum Theory.

Hawking has a different opinion on this. But we are talking about Goedels theorem of incompleteness and I gave a hint of the second theorem of incompleteness of Geodel which explains, why we cannot prove Theory A with Theory B. The Axiomatic of both Theories will forbid it.

 

[DarkoDornel]

Hawking is pulling on strings ( pardon the pun!). There is no theory of everything, it does not fit in too the realities of universe. We think of the theories of today and the past has a house, we dig the foundations, and we layed the floor...and that is it. I do not believe in the big bang at all!

 

[DarkoDornel]

Not is impossible...it just that we try to hard to complete something. If one scientist says one thing its gospel...everybody starts giving into them, sending them into ego trip!

 

[MacRudi]

Hawking is pulling on strings ( pardon the pun!). There is no theory of everything, it does not fit in too the realities of universe. We think of the theories of today and the past has a house, we dig the foundations, and we layed the floor...and that is it. I do not believe in the big bang at all!

sure it is a question of believing systems in science. Are we Platon believer or are we Wittgenstein believer.

 

[DarkoDornel]

I believe that mankind could do better, but its the arrogance of everything in the present.

 

[DrClaude]

This thread has quickly descended into pure philosophy, which is not suitable for PF.

Thread closed.

Edit: OP has been allowed to ask the question again: https://www.physicsforums.com/threads/godels-its-the-physical-world-is-a-toe-impossible.847692/