Hard time visualizing gradient vector vs. tangent vector.

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the visualization and understanding of the gradient vector in relation to the tangent vector and tangent plane, particularly in the context of functions of two and three variables. Participants explore the geometric interpretation of these concepts and how they relate to level curves and surfaces.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion about how the gradient vector, which indicates the direction of increasing function values, can be perpendicular to the tangent plane at a point.
  • Another participant clarifies that the gradient vector is perpendicular to the level curves in the X-Y plane, not necessarily to the function itself, and that this applies differently when considering functions of three variables.
  • A third participant emphasizes that the gradient is indeed perpendicular to the level curve formed by the function at a specific value, suggesting that understanding this relationship is key to visualizing the gradient's direction.
  • One participant suggests starting with simpler functions of two variables before tackling more complex functions of three variables to aid understanding.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that the gradient vector is related to level curves and that it is perpendicular to them. However, there is some disagreement and confusion regarding the relationship between the gradient vector and the tangent plane, particularly when transitioning from two to three dimensions.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the importance of visualizing the gradient in both two and three dimensions, indicating that the interpretation may vary based on the dimensionality of the function being discussed.

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OK, this is really confusing me. Mostly because i suck at spatial stuff.

If the gradient vector at a given point points in the direction in which a function is increasing, then how can it be perpendicular to the tangent plane at that point? If it's perpendicular to the tangent plane, wouldn't it be perpendicular to the function too?

This is the Wikipedia image for the gradient of a function, and it's pretty much what I imagine when I think of it: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/3/31/Gradient99.png"

but if those lines were perpendicular to the tangent planes at their given points, wouldn't they all be pointing away from the graph (like "hairs")?

Or is it just saying that it's perpendicular to the level curves? -- the pictures are very confusing and they always look like it's pointing away from a tangent plane, which makes no sense to me.

EDIT: I think I got confused because it was an example with a function of three variables f(x,y,z) and I was thinking about it in f(x,y).
 
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The graph at Wikipedia is a function of two variables f(x,y). If you take the gradient of this function (or a scalar field), it would be the 2-D vector as plotted on graph in the X-Y plane. The discussion of being perpendicular is in the X-Y plane but not the X-Y-Z space.

So what is tangential is the line tangential to the level curves and the gradient vector is perpendicular to these tangential lines.

If you have a function f(x,y,z), then its gradient vector would be 3-D and its level curves would be surfaces. I use to image a cloud of colored dots, whose color corresponds to f. This gradient vector would be perpendicular to the surface.

I had confused myself over this and this is my understanding
 
I think that it is not the tangent plane but the level curve that the gradient is perpendicular to, i.e. when the function is at a certain value. For e.g. a function of x and y then the level surface is not that tangent to the function, but an arbitrary curve formed by the function on any value of the function i.e. f(x,y)=c. So let us imagine a cone as an example. At any value of the function, the level curve would be like a circle on a plane parallel to the xy plane. The gradient is perpendicular to this level curve. To further determine the direction of the gradient, use the theorem that the gradient points in the direction of the highest increase.

I was also confused at first at these concepts, but after clarifying it I finally understood.

Hope this helps cheers!
 
You should think of the simplest case where f(x,y) before moving on to f(x,y,z...).
 

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