Help Max Get Started on a Discrete Math Proof for Sum of Consecutive Integers

Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around a discrete math proof concerning the arrangement of the first ten integers around a circle and the existence of three consecutive integers whose sum is greater than or equal to 17. The original poster expresses difficulty in starting the proof and seeks guidance based on a previous proof by contradiction related to averages.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster attempts to connect their previous proof by contradiction to the current problem but struggles to see its relevance. They question whether any set of three integers can be used to demonstrate a contradiction.
  • Another participant suggests defining a new variable to represent the sum of each integer and its neighbors, proposing a contradiction based on the average of these sums.
  • Further discussion includes questioning the validity of specific examples and the implications of averages in the context of the proof.

Discussion Status

Participants are exploring various interpretations of the problem and discussing the implications of averages in the context of the proof. Some guidance has been offered regarding the use of contradiction, but there is no explicit consensus on the approach to take.

Contextual Notes

There is a noted confusion regarding the application of previous knowledge to the current problem, particularly in how averages relate to the arrangement of integers around the circle. Participants are also addressing the challenge of proving the statement for all possible arrangements of the integers.

maxsthekat
Messages
55
Reaction score
0
I'm completely stumped on how to begin a discrete math proof, and I'm looking for a little advice on what might be a good way to approach this.

In a previous problem I did a proof by contradiction to show that at least one of the real numbers a1, a2, ... an is greater than or equal to the average of these numbers.

This was done by a1 + a2 + ... + an < nA.
By definition, A = (a1 + a2 + ... + an)/n, which is a contradiction of the assumption, and therefore proving a1, a2, ... an \le average of these numbers.

However, now I'm supposed to use this info to prove that if the first 10 integers are placed around a circle, in any order, there exists three integers in consecutive locations around the circle that have a sum greater than or equal to 17.

I have no idea where to go with this. Can someone give me a pointer that could help me start?

Thanks!

-Max
 
Physics news on Phys.org
Let b_i be the ith number plus its two neighbors. Then you wish to show that for at least one i you have b_i \geq 17, so for the sake of contradiction assume b_i \leq 16 for all i. Now compute the average A=(b_1+\cdots+b_{10})/10 and apply your previous result.
 
Thanks, rasmhop :)

So, with the contradiction, in order to show that the contradiction is false, can I take any set of three integers to show it is false? For example, can I simply assert there would be a ring where 8, 9, and 10 are neighbors, and thus the contradiction is false?

I'm still not quite certain how the knowledge from the previous problem is useful. I see that A = 5.66, which means that one of the integers selected will be bigger than 6. Yet, this alone doesn't seem to imply there will be neighbors that will ensure the result is greater than 17.

Thanks again :)
 
maxsthekat said:
I'm still not quite certain how the knowledge from the previous problem is useful. I see that A = 5.66, which means that one of the integers selected will be bigger than 6. Yet, this alone doesn't seem to imply there will be neighbors that will ensure the result is greater than 17.
Your average is incorrect. b_1+\cdots+b_{10} counts each number of 1,2,...,10 three times so we have,
A = \frac{b_1+b_2+\cdots+b_{10}}{10} = \frac{3(1+2+\cdots+10)}{10} = 165/10 &gt; 16
The average is larger than 16, so at least one b_i must be larger than 16 which contradicts that they are all less than or equal to 16.

So, with the contradiction, in order to show that the contradiction is false, can I take any set of three integers to show it is false? For example, can I simply assert there would be a ring where 8, 9, and 10 are neighbors, and thus the contradiction is false?
No because you're supposed to prove it for all possible ways to place the numbers around the circle and in general 8,9,10 won't be consecutive.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 16 ·
Replies
16
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
9K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
4K
Replies
10
Views
4K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 12 ·
Replies
12
Views
4K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
8K
Replies
12
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K