How Can Gravitational Lensing Help Detect Dark Energy?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the potential use of gravitational lensing as a method to detect dark energy over cosmological distances. Participants explore the implications of this approach on various cosmological equations and concepts, raising questions and challenges regarding the assumptions made in the referenced paper.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses surprise that the idea of using gravitational lensing to measure dark energy hasn't been suggested before and raises questions about its implications for the apparent angular size of remote structures and the Friedmann equations.
  • Another participant suggests that the paper may contain a basic error, arguing that the curvature of light paths is ultimately determined by the geometry of space-time, and that dark energy's non-clustering nature limits its lensing effects to those described by the Friedmann equations.
  • A different participant agrees that the paper does not adequately account for other contributors to curvature and questions the novelty of the approach, suggesting it aligns with a Lambda-only universe model.
  • This participant also notes potential issues with the treatment of quintessence in the paper, indicating a need for further investigation into the relevant literature.
  • Another participant mentions that the even distribution of dark energy across the cosmos may explain why lensing effects are only detectable at cosmological distances.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the validity and novelty of the paper's approach, with some agreeing on the need for more thorough consideration of other factors influencing curvature, while others question the assumptions made regarding dark energy and its effects.

Contextual Notes

Participants note limitations in the assumptions made in the paper, particularly regarding the removal of matter and radiation fields, and the treatment of scalar field models, indicating that these aspects may affect the conclusions drawn.

Chronos
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This paper; https://arxiv.org/abs/1701.03418, Direct Probe of Dark Energy through Gravitational Lensing Effect, addresses a potential means to measure dark energy over cosmological distances. Perhaps I am a bit slow, but, I found the basic idea sufficiently simple and obvious that I am surprised it hasn't been suggested before. Perhaps it was, and it merely eluded my attention. I feel flooded with questions I cannot yet even fully articulate. A couple which have surfaced include - 1] How might reverse lensing due to DE impact the apparent angular size of remote structures in the universe? 2] How might this affect the Friedmann equations?
 
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Chronos said:
This paper; https://arxiv.org/abs/1701.03418, Direct Probe of Dark Energy through Gravitational Lensing Effect, addresses a potential means to measure dark energy over cosmological distances. Perhaps I am a bit slow, but, I found the basic idea sufficiently simple and obvious that I am surprised it hasn't been suggested before. Perhaps it was, and it merely eluded my attention. I feel flooded with questions I cannot yet even fully articulate. A couple which have surfaced include - 1] How might reverse lensing due to DE impact the apparent angular size of remote structures in the universe? 2] How might this affect the Friedmann equations?
I could be wrong, but at first blush it sounds to me like they're making a very basic error. The thing that ultimately curves light paths in the universe is the geometry of space-time. Since Dark Energy doesn't cluster (it can't to have the properties it has), its impact is going to be just the impact of curvature that appears in the Friedmann equations, where the only effect that looks like lensing stems from the spatial curvature parameter.

Maybe I'm wrong. I'm sure other cosmologists will weigh in on the paper within the next few weeks. But it really does not seem right to me.
 
I agree they are not factoring out other contributors to the curvature. This paper is under the assumption of removal of matter/radiation fields.

I don't see any thing new here Everything on the would be true in a Lamba only toy universe. Unless I too am mistaken. So thanks for sharing Chronos

Though for scalar field modelling its got a good collection of relevant formulas P.

edit I have to double check but quintessence seems off as well. I need to dig out the correct textbooks I have on it. Yeah there is something off with what they have for quintessence. The tracker field w_q is time varying according to both wiki and Matt Roose. However to be completely honest I'm not really sure. So I dug up a review on it just in case anyone is interested.

https://arxiv.org/abs/1304.1961

Probably not important enough to go through a lot of effort lol
 
Last edited:
That dark energy is evenly distributed across the cosmos appears to explain why the lensing effect is only detectable across cosmological distances.
 

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