How Can You Prove the Scalar Product of Two Lines Geometrically?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around proving the scalar product of two lines geometrically, specifically the relationship involving the cosine of the angle between them and their direction cosines. Participants explore the geometric proof without relying on vector concepts, while also referencing trigonometric considerations and the law of cosines.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant requests a geometric proof of the equation involving the cosine of the angle between two lines and their direction cosines.
  • Another participant questions the meaning of "geometric considerations," suggesting a proof without using vectors.
  • A participant mentions the cosine rule and attempts to relate it to the given equation, expressing uncertainty about the application.
  • Some participants assert that the law of cosines and the dot product formula are equivalent, suggesting that either could be used for the proof.
  • There is a discussion about the implications of using the dot product formula versus the law of cosines, with some arguing that deriving one from the other may complicate the proof.
  • A participant clarifies that the book requested a proof based on trigonometric considerations, indicating a misunderstanding regarding the dot product.
  • Another participant proposes using the cosine law to derive the required relationship, presenting a method involving the subtraction of vectors.
  • One participant expresses gratitude for the proposed method but remains uncertain if it aligns with the original request for trigonometric considerations.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the best approach to prove the scalar product geometrically. Multiple competing views on the use of the law of cosines versus the dot product formula remain evident throughout the discussion.

Contextual Notes

Some participants express uncertainty about the definitions and applications of the cosine rule and the dot product, indicating that the discussion may depend on specific interpretations of geometric proofs.

Karol
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Two lines A and B. The angle between them is θ, their direction cosines are (α,β,γ) and (α',β',γ'). Prove, ON GEOMETRIC CONSIDERATIONS:
##\cos\theta=\cos\alpha\cos\alpha'+\cos\beta\cos\beta'+\cos\gamma\cos\gamma'##

I posted this question long ago and i was told that this is the scalar product and i accepted then, but now i read further in the book and they explain the scalar product but still want the geometric proof.
 

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Mathematics news on Phys.org
What do you mean, "On GEOMETRIC CONSIDERATIONS"?

Do you mean you want a proof without using vectors?
 
well i don't know, i think without since i was asked at the beginning of studying vectors. the book explained the inner product and the equation i gave, but asked to prove it on geometric basis.
I was told that the cosine rule is involved but i don't know how:
$$C^2=A^2+B^2-2AB\cos\theta\;\rightarrow C^2=1+1-2\cos\theta$$
$$C^2=\cos^2\alpha+\cos^2\beta+\cos^2\gamma+\cos^2\alpha'+\cos^2\beta'+\cos^2\gamma'-2\cos\theta$$
 

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If you regarded ##A,B## as two unit vectors, then their scalar product would be what you write.
For $$A\cdot B=|A||B|\cos\theta=x_Ax_B+y_Ay_B+z_Az_B,$$
then $$1\cdot1\cdot\cos\theta=\cos\alpha\cos\alpha'+\cos\beta\cos\beta'+\cos\gamma\cos\gamma'.$$
 
the law of cosines and the dot product formula are two equivalent statements. you can derive one from the other, so i don't think it matters which you use
 
cpsinkule said:
the law of cosines and the dot product formula are two equivalent statements. you can derive one from the other, so i don't think it matters which you use
Why do you think they are equivalent?
Moreover, here using cosine law may be harder to get the anticipated result.
 
tommyxu3 said:
Why do you think they are equivalent?
Moreover, here using cosine law may be harder to get the anticipated result.
if you take the dot product formula as being true, then you can derive the law of cosines

if you take the law of cosines to be true, you can derive the dot product formula
 
The book asked to prove
$$\cos\theta=\cos\alpha\cos\alpha'+\cos\beta\cos\beta'+\cos\gamma\cos\gamma'$$
Before they taught the dot product, and they said i have to prove it with trigonometric considerations.
I made a mistake in writing in the OP about the dot product since when i was asked to prove it i wasn't expected to know about the dot product.
 
Yes, then you could use cosine law.
For ##A=(\cos\alpha,\cos\beta,\cos\gamma),B=(\cos\alpha',\cos\beta',\cos\gamma'),## the triangle they make may have the third side, which we can present it as a vector ##C## that ##C=A-B=(\cos\alpha-\cos\alpha',\cos\beta-\cos\beta',\cos\gamma-\cos\gamma').##
Now use cosine law:
$$|C|^2=|A|^2+|B|^2-2|A||B|\cos\theta$$
$$\Rightarrow(\cos\alpha-\cos\alpha')^2+(\cos\beta-\cos\beta')^2+(\cos\gamma-\cos\gamma')^2=(\cos\alpha)^2+(\cos\beta)^2+(\cos\gamma)^2+(\cos\alpha')^2+(\cos\beta')^2+(\cos\gamma')^2-2\cdot 1\cdot 1\cdot \cos\theta$$
$$\Rightarrow\cos\theta=\cos\alpha\cos\alpha'+\cos\beta\cos\beta'+\cos\gamma\cos\gamma'$$
##Q.E.D.##
 
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I thank you very much tommyxu3, i am not sure that that is what they meant by trigonometric considerations, especially not the presentation of C as the subtraction of 2 vectors but it's good and the best i had, it really satisfied me, tommyxu3, thanks
 

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