How Does Layering Affect Beta Particle Penetration and Energy Loss?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the effects of layering aluminum foils on the penetration and energy loss of beta particles. Participants explore whether a single thick foil or multiple thinner foils with spacing is more effective for shielding against beta radiation, considering factors such as air gaps and beta particle energy.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Experimental/applied
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose using aluminum foils as absorbers for beta particles and question whether a single thick foil or multiple thinner foils with air gaps is preferable.
  • Others argue that the total thickness of aluminum is the primary factor affecting beta particle energy loss, suggesting that air gaps may not significantly alter the outcome.
  • A participant notes that the effectiveness of shielding depends on the arrangement of the foils and the energy of the beta particles, indicating that beta particles can be stopped in air but have a larger range compared to aluminum.
  • One participant presents a scenario involving two identical aluminum foils placed at different distances from a beta particle source and questions whether this arrangement would yield different detection counts.
  • Another participant suggests that the order of materials (air vs. aluminum) can influence the results, as the mass stopping power varies with the energy of the beta particles.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the impact of layering and spacing of aluminum foils on beta particle penetration and energy loss. There is no consensus on whether the arrangement significantly affects the results, and the discussion remains unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Participants mention the finite range of beta particles in air and the specific energy levels of the beta particles, which may influence the effectiveness of the shielding. The discussion includes assumptions about the uniformity of materials and the conditions under which the experiments are conducted.

prochatz
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If we want to secure an area from beta particles, we could use absorbers, for example aluminum foils. Is it preferable to use one thick aluminum foil or several aluminum foils (with same total density as the first one of course) with free space between them? In other words, does a beta particle lose energy differently while passing through a thick foil in comparison with a beta particle passing through several foils.
 
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it depends how tight you have the Al-foils and what beta-energy you have. Remember that beta particles are stopped in pure air too. But the range in air is of course much larger than for Al, so if you want to shield effectivly, I would use a thick Al- foil

Do you understand?
 
prochatz said:
If we want to secure an area from beta particles, we could use absorbers, for example aluminum foils. Is it preferable to use one thick aluminum foil or several aluminum foils (with same total density as the first one of course) with free space between them? In other words, does a beta particle lose energy differently while passing through a thick foil in comparison with a beta particle passing through several foils.
Only the total thickness of Al matters.
 
pam said:
Only the total thickness of Al matters.


but does not air play a role?

10cm-Al that is positioned 5cm from the source, or:
10 1cm-Al that has 1m spacing between each 1cm-Al pair

Is not the same thing...since beta particles has a finite range in pure air.
 
malawi_glenn said:
it depends how tight you have the Al-foils and what beta-energy you have. Remember that beta particles are stopped in pure air too. But the range in air is of course much larger than for Al, so if you want to shield effectivly, I would use a thick Al- foil

Do you understand?

Thanks for your answer.

Suppose we have two identical aluminium foils and a source that emits a vertical beam of beta particles (Sr-90). Suppose that I place a G.M. detector in a distance of 6cm over the source. Then, I do two procedures:

a) I place the two identical Al-foils very close each other in the distance of 3cm from the source.

b)I place the first Al-foil in the distance of 2cm from the source and the second one in the distance of 4cm from the source.

Will I notice any difference in the counts of the G.M. scintillator? In other words, do the two procedures absorb equally the beta particles?
 
you should get a very small difference, since we have only magnitudes of a few centimeters.

you know how to calculate this theoretically?

I don't remember excactly, was a time since i did basic nuclear experiments, but I believe that average beta particles has a range of like one meter in air.

http://trshare.triumf.ca/~safety/EHS/rpt/rpt_2/node23.html
 
malawi_glenn said:
you should get a very small difference, since we have only magnitudes of a few centimeters.

Isn't it weird? In both the previous procedures, beta particles are traversing the same distance in air and two Al-foils. Shoudn't the counts be the same?
 
the order plays role too.

If you have 1cm Al then 5cm air or vice versa etc, makes a small difference.

The mass stopping power depends on the incoming energy of the radiation, so if the particle exits the source with 5MeV then enters air, you have a specific value of the mass stopping power in air, and after passing the 5cm of air, you will have a specific value of the energy that enters the 1cm Al and another specific value of the mass stopping power in Al.

But as I said, it is a very very small difference in this case.

Have you worked with this theoretically as a preparation of this lab?
 
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