Ideal Opamp Analysis: Determine Vout for Vin = 2V & Vs = 15V

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the analysis of an ideal operational amplifier (op-amp) to determine the output voltage (Vout) given an input voltage (Vin) of 2V and a supply voltage (Vs) of 15V. The scope includes theoretical considerations of op-amp behavior, particularly in relation to feedback and output saturation.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that with an infinite gain of the ideal op-amp and a substantial difference between V+ and V-, the output would theoretically be infinitely large but would instead max out at Vs.
  • Another participant agrees and elaborates that proper DC feedback is necessary for linear amplification, which helps establish a suitable operating point between supply voltages.
  • A different participant points out that the output would be pinned at the -Vs rail due to the inverting input being higher than the non-inverting input.
  • There is a question about whether the output should be -15V, with some uncertainty expressed about the behavior of different op-amps regarding their ability to drive outputs to the rails.
  • A later reply asks for clarification on whether this scenario is from a schoolwork assignment, indicating a potential context for the question.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the output voltage behavior of the op-amp, particularly regarding whether it would be -15V or if it could reach the rails, indicating that multiple competing views remain unresolved.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the assumptions about the op-amp's behavior, particularly regarding feedback and the specific characteristics of the ideal op-amp versus real-world op-amps.

joel amos
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Given this ideal op-amp, determine Vout if Vin = 2V and Vs = 15 V.
k97403.jpg

So I know that the ideal op-amp has infinite gain. As the difference between V+ and V- is substantial (2V), wouldn't that mean the output would theoretically by infinitely large but instead max out at Vs? Am I understanding correctly, or am I way off?
 
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Yes - you are right. Each application of opamps as linear amplifiers requires dc feedback. This allows a suitable dc operating point in the mddle region between the supply voltages as well as an amplification factor that is determined by the feedback resistors only.
Otherwise, even very small input voltages cannot be amplified (in case of REAL opamps) because an always present offset voltage will drive the output into saturation.
 
Okay, that makes sense. Thanks for the response!
 
The way it is drawn the output would be pinned at the -Vs rail, not Vs. The inverting input (-) is higher than the non-inverting input (+) here.
 
So it should be -15 V?
 
joel amos said:
So it should be -15 V?

Depends on the opamp. Some can drive their output to the rails, and others saturate somewhere close to the rails (within a volt or two). If you are to assume it is an ideal opamp, what do you think?

BTW, is this from a schoolwork assignment? What is the context of the question?
 

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