Integration by parts not working for a particualr integral

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the challenges of evaluating the integral of \( e^{-x} \cos(kx) \) using integration by parts. Participants explore various methods and approaches to tackle this integral, including suggestions for alternative techniques.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • The original poster (OP) expresses difficulty in applying integration by parts to the integral, resulting in a circular equation.
  • One participant suggests a method involving the complex exponential representation of cosine, proposing \( \cos(kx) = \mathfrak{Re}(e^{ikx}) \).
  • Another participant provides a detailed solution using integration by parts, breaking down the integral into manageable parts.
  • Some participants argue about the appropriateness of providing complete solutions versus encouraging the OP to attempt the integral independently for practice.
  • There is a disagreement on whether showing the complete solution is more beneficial than allowing the OP to struggle through the problem to learn from the experience.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the best approach to assist the OP. Some advocate for providing complete solutions, while others emphasize the value of independent problem-solving and learning through failure.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the OP's initial attempt at integration by parts was incorrect, leading to confusion. There are also discussions about the philosophy of the forum regarding problem-solving approaches.

DocZaius
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Integration by parts not working for a particular integral

When I attempt to use the method of integration by parts on the below integral, I don't get anywhere since I only arrive at the statement a = -b +b -a where a is the integral and b is the boundary term.

[itex]\int e^{-x}\text{Cos}[k x]dx=-e^{-x}(-\text{Cos}[k x])-\left(-e^{-x}(-\text{Cos}[k x])-\int e^{-x}\text{Cos}[k x]dx\right)[/itex]

Do you know of another method I could use to evaluate this integral?

Thanks
 
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DocZaius said:
When I attempt to use the method of integration by parts on the below integral, I don't get anywhere since I only arrive at the statement a = -b +b -a where a is the integal and b is the boundary term.

[itex]\int e^{-x}\text{Cos}[k x]dx=-e^{-x}(-\text{Cos}[k x])-\left(-e^{-x}(-\text{Cos}[k x])-\int e^{-x}\text{Cos}[k x]dx\right)[/itex]

Do you know of another method I could use to evaluate this Intgral?

Thanks


$$u=e^{-x}\Longrightarrow\,u'=-e^{-x}\;\;\;\;,\;\;\;v'=\cos kx\Longrightarrow v=\frac{1}{k}\sin kx\Longrightarrow$$

$$\int e^{-x}\cos kx\,dx=\frac{1}{k}e^{-x}\sin kx+\frac{1}{k}\int e^{-x}\sin kx\,dx$$

Once again by parts:

$$u=e^{-x}\Longrightarrow u'=-e^{-x}\;\;\;,\;\;v'=\sin kx\Longrightarrow v=-\frac{1}{k}\cos kx$$

so

$$\int e^{-x}\cos kx\,dx=\frac{1}{k}e^{-x}\sin kx-\frac{1}{k^2}e^{-x}\cos kx-\frac{1}{k^2}\int e^{-x}\cos kx\,dx\Longrightarrow$$

$$\left(1+\frac{1}{k^2}\right)\int e^{-x}\cos kx\,dx =\frac{e^{-x}}{k^2}\left(k\sin kx-\cos kx\right)$$

...and etc.

DonAntonio
 
A nifty trick would be to write [itex]\cos k x = \mathfrak{Re}\left(e^{ikx}\right)[/itex].
 


DonAntonio said:
*snip complete solution*

I have to question the value for the OP of having his problem solved completely. It would have been better just to point out that if he integrates [itex]e^{-x}\cos(kx)[/itex] by parts he should get
[tex] \int e^{-x}\cos kx\,\mathrm{d}x=\frac{1}{k}e^{-x}\sin kx+\frac{1}{k}\int e^{-x}\sin kx\,\mathrm{d}x[/tex]
and let him try to integrate [itex]e^{-x}\sin(kx)[/itex] himself, since he clearly needs the practice.
 


pasmith said:
I have to question the value for the OP of having his problem solved completely. It would have been better just to point out that if he integrates [itex]e^{-x}\cos(kx)[/itex] by parts he should get
[tex] \int e^{-x}\cos kx\,\mathrm{d}x=\frac{1}{k}e^{-x}\sin kx+\frac{1}{k}\int e^{-x}\sin kx\,\mathrm{d}x[/tex]
and let him try to integrate [itex]e^{-x}\sin(kx)[/itex] himself, since he clearly needs the practice.

Yeah, I picked the wrong parts of my integral as my u and dv. Definitely redoing it all myself so don't worry, I'm getting that practice :)
 


pasmith said:
I have to question the value for the OP of having his problem solved completely. It would have been better just to point out that if he integrates [itex]e^{-x}\cos(kx)[/itex] by parts he should get
[tex] \int e^{-x}\cos kx\,\mathrm{d}x=\frac{1}{k}e^{-x}\sin kx+\frac{1}{k}\int e^{-x}\sin kx\,\mathrm{d}x[/tex]
and let him try to integrate [itex]e^{-x}\sin(kx)[/itex] himself, since he clearly needs the practice.
The OP specifically stated that he tried integrating by parts and, obviously, he got that wrong. Showing the way

to him, even if it is a huge portion of the complete solution, is imo more helping than merely saying to do something

he already failed at.

DonAntonio
 


DonAntonio said:
The OP specifically stated that he tried integrating by parts and, obviously, he got that wrong. Showing the way

to him, even if it is a huge portion of the complete solution, is imo more helping than merely saying to do something
I disagree. IMO you learn better by trying a few things that fail and then something that succeeds, than you do when someone shows you.

What's more, this is the philosophy of this forum, as exemplified in its rules, which you agreed to abide by when you joined.
DonAntonio said:
he already failed at.

DonAntonio
 

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