Is Fatio–Le Sage's theory of gravitation an entropic gravity?

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SUMMARY

The discussion centers on the relationship between Fatio–Le Sage's theory of gravitation and entropic gravity, highlighting that while both theories share similarities, they are fundamentally different. Entropic gravity, as described in papers from 2011 and 2013, is based on the entropy of black holes and quantum information, while Fatio–Le Sage's theory, proposed centuries ago, posits gravity as a result of high-speed particles. Despite some intuitive connections, the consensus is that Fatio–Le Sage's theory has been disproven, and any association with entropic gravity could undermine its credibility. Recent papers, including those from 2023 and 2025, explore these theories but do not establish a formal intersection.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of entropic gravity as defined in the 2011 and 2013 papers.
  • Familiarity with Fatio–Le Sage's theory of gravitation and its historical context.
  • Knowledge of quantum information theory and its implications for gravity.
  • Awareness of the holographic principle and its relevance to modern physics.
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  • Research the implications of the holographic principle on gravity theories.
  • Study the entropy of black holes as discussed in the 2011 paper in the Journal of High Energy Physics.
  • Examine the quantum information aspects of gravity as presented in the 2013 Journal of the Korean Physical Society paper.
  • Investigate the criticisms and experimental evidence against Fatio–Le Sage's theory of gravitation.
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Physicists, researchers in gravitational theories, and students of modern physics seeking to understand the distinctions and connections between historical and contemporary theories of gravity.

  • #31
A critique in Spanish of Verlinde's entropic gravity, (can be translated) https://francis.naukas.com/2017/12/23/inconsistencias-de-la-gravedad-entropica-de-verlinde/

The summary is that on the one hand we have a Newtonian theory type MOND (entropic gravity) and on the other hand we have a Newtonian graviton theory (Le Sage), and you want to know if they correspond. I understand that your doubt from a theoretical point of view may be interesting, but no one invests time in proving that wrong corresponds to wrong.

Needless to say, none of this corresponds to relativity.
 
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  • #32
Jerome Wang said:
Le Sage gravity is certainly a falsified theory
Excellent. I am glad you recognize that.

Jerome Wang said:
However, just as the falsification of other gravitational theories that are also based on space-time geometry does not mean that general relativity is falsified, the falsification of Le Sage gravity does not mean that any modifications and developments related to Le Sage gravity are falsified.
True, but insofar as they are not falsified, they must prove that they differ from Le Sage gravity. And we certainly don’t name successful theories after the creator of an earlier falsified theory.

This association only increases the skepticism towards entropic gravity. It does not justify Le Sage gravity.
 
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  • #33
javisot20 said:
A critique in Spanish of Verlinde's entropic gravity, (can be translated) https://francis.naukas.com/2017/12/23/inconsistencias-de-la-gravedad-entropica-de-verlinde/

The summary is that on the one hand we have a Newtonian theory type MOND (entropic gravity) and on the other hand we have a Newtonian graviton theory (Le Sage), and you want to know if they correspond. I understand that your doubt from a theoretical point of view may be interesting, but no one invests time in proving that wrong corresponds to wrong.

Needless to say, none of this corresponds to relativity.
Dale said:
This association only increases the skepticism towards entropic gravity. It does not justify Le Sage gravity.
Taking into account Milky Way could invalidate the hypothesis of exotic matter and favor a gravitomagnetic solution to explain dark matter and Supernovae evidence for foundational change to cosmological models, the part of this criticism based on the dark universe is not robust, while the robust part is whether it is consistent with itself and whether it can be consistent with general relativity.

However, even the criticism of the consistency of entropic gravity itself and whether it is compatible with general relativity is also seriously problematic, because Gravity from quantum information is based on ordinary quantum field theory in curved spacetime rather than Verlinde's method.

Stepping back, even without considering Gravity from quantum information, the failure of Verlinde's entropic gravity means it is necessary to re-examine the holographic principle and black hole thermodynamics.
 
  • #34
Jerome Wang said:
Taking into account Milky Way could invalidate the hypothesis of exotic matter and favor a gravitomagnetic solution to explain dark matter and Supernovae evidence for foundational change to cosmological models, the part of this criticism based on the dark universe is not robust, while the robust part is whether it is consistent with itself and whether it can be consistent with general relativity.

However, even the criticism of the consistency of entropic gravity itself and whether it is compatible with general relativity is also seriously problematic, because Gravity from quantum information is based on ordinary quantum field theory in curved spacetime rather than Verlinde's method.

Stepping back, even without considering Gravity from quantum information, the failure of Verlinde's entropic gravity means it is necessary to re-examine the holographic principle and black hole thermodynamics.
At this point we're well off the thread topic, and this post is just personal opinion. That's not conducive to productive discussion. Thread closed.
 
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