Is tensor product the same as dyadic product of two vectors?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the relationship between the tensor product and the dyadic product of two vectors, exploring their definitions, properties, and implications in both mathematical and physical contexts. Participants examine the nature of these products, their representations as matrices, and their roles in encoding information in vector spaces.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that the dyadic product is a specific case of the tensor product, while others clarify that a tensor product can involve more than two components and can be expressed as a sum of dyadic products.
  • There is a suggestion that dyadic multiplication can be equated to matrix multiplication, specifically involving a column vector and a row vector.
  • One participant expresses confusion regarding the abstraction of tensor product spaces and the varying explanations found in different sources.
  • Another participant discusses the tensor product as a construction that creates a new vector space, emphasizing its role in making bilinear maps linear.
  • Questions arise about whether the tensor product creates a mathematical object that is also a bilinear map, and how this relates to linear transformations in vector spaces.
  • There is mention of the physical intuition behind rank-2 dyadic tensors and their representation as 2x2 matrices, which encode information from two vectors.
  • One participant highlights the distinction between tensors acting on other objects and other objects acting on tensors, indicating a broader confusion about tensors in general.
  • A participant notes that the tensor product of two vector spaces results in a vector space whose dimension is the product of the dimensions of the original spaces, and that bilinear maps can be factored into linear maps involving the tensor product.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the definitions and implications of the tensor product and dyadic product, indicating that the discussion remains unresolved with multiple competing perspectives.

Contextual Notes

Some limitations include the abstract nature of tensor products, the dependence on specific definitions, and the unresolved mathematical steps regarding bilinear maps and their linearity in relation to tensor products.

xopek
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Is tensor product the same as dyadic product of two vectors? And dyadic multiplication is just matrix multiplication? You have a column vector on the left and a row vector on the right and you just multiply them and that's it? We just create a matrix out of two vectors so we encode two different things, such a stress tensor in different directions? Sounds too simple to be true. I tried reading about the tensor product space and it was way too abstract and every source gives a different explanation.
 
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xopek said:
Is tensor product the same as dyadic product of two vectors?
The dyadic product is a tensor product, but a tensor product can have more than two components and is in general also the sum of e.g. dyadic products.

xopek said:
And dyadic multiplication is just matrix multiplication?
Yes. Column times row.
xopek said:
You have a column vector on the left and a row vector on the right and you just multiply them and that's it? We just create a matrix out of two vectors so we encode two different things, such a stress tensor in different directions? Sounds too simple to be true. I tried reading about the tensor product space and it was way too abstract and every source gives a different explanation.
Try this one:
https://www.physicsforums.com/insights/what-is-a-tensor/

What is a derivative? There are plenty of ways to consider it: slope, linear function, limit, etc. And like
$$
D_2(x^2)=\left.\dfrac{d}{dx}\right|_{x=2} (x^2)=4
$$
can be viewed as the linear function ##x\longmapsto 4\cdot x## can tensors be considered as multilinear functions. This is especially in physics the case. So although they are simply a number scheme, they are simultaneously functions, too.
 
At the vector space level, the tensor product of two vector spaces over the same field is a new vector space
over which all bilinear maps into a fixed 3rd vector space becomes linear. It's one of those category-theoretical constructions. But maybe you were looking for more Physical intuition?
 
WWGD said:
a new vector space over which all bilinear maps into a fixed 3rd vector space becomes linear.
So the tensor product creates a mathematical object called a tensor? And that object is also a bilinear map? And in case of two components it is also a 2-dimensional matrix? I know that typically a 2-dimensional matrix is a linear transformation map in a 2D vector space such as a rotation map that takes a vector and spits out another vector. But in our case this matrix (our dyadic tensor) is a bilinear map which takes two input vectors and spits out a scalar. I know that a bilinear map can become linear with one of the components held constant, i.e. what happens in a dual space V* where a covariant vector v* takes a contravariant vector v from V and produces a scalar. Is this what happens in case of the tensor product space as well?

WWGD said:
But maybe you were looking for more Physical intuition?
Yes, that too. I was thinking of something simple such as rank-2 dyadic tensor, say in two dimensions, when two 2D vectors are "mixed" together into a 2x2 matrix aka dyadic tensor which then encodes two pieces of information coming from the two vectors, say, an angle and a direction. My main confusion is the distinction between some other object acting on a tensor, and a tensor acting on other objects. And pretty much everything about tensors.
 
Yes, the tensor product $$ V \otimes W$$ of two vector spaces $$V, W $$ over the same field is a vector space whose dimension is the product of the dimensions of $$V \and W $$, so that every bilinear map $$ B: V \times W \rightarrow Z$$ factors into a linear map $$L$$ from $$ V \otimes W \rightarrow Z $$
So that the diagram commutes. Sorry, I don't know how to implement diagrams here in PF.
 

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