Is the QED Action Invariant Under Gauge Transformation?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the invariance of the Quantum Electrodynamics (QED) action under gauge transformations. The original poster presents a problem statement that requires demonstrating this invariance, along with relevant equations and their attempts at a solution.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster attempts to show how the covariant derivative and the fields transform under gauge transformations, raising questions about specific steps in their calculations.
  • Some participants question the clarity and correctness of the original poster's reasoning, particularly regarding the treatment of derivatives and the transformations applied.
  • Others suggest that the issues may stem from misunderstandings of the definitions or properties of the functions involved.
  • One participant notes a potential logical circularity in the approach being taken to derive the coupling term from the invariance of the action.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants providing feedback and alternative perspectives on the original poster's attempts. Some guidance has been offered regarding the treatment of derivatives and the need for clarity in definitions. Multiple interpretations of the problem are being explored, but no consensus has been reached.

Contextual Notes

Participants are navigating the complexities of gauge transformations in the context of QED, with specific attention to the implications of coordinate-dependent functions and the Noether procedure. There is an acknowledgment of potential misunderstandings in the original poster's approach.

Cirrus79
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Hello,

I don't understand two steps in solution to the problem:

I. Homework Statement

Show that QED action is invariant under gauge transformation.

II. Relevant equations

QED action:

S= \int{d^{4} x \left[\overline{\Psi}\left(i\gamma^{\mu} D_{\mu} -m \right)\Psi -\frac{1}{4}F_{\mu \nu}F^{\mu \nu}\right]}

Gauge transformation:

\Psi\rightarrow e^{-iQ\chi}\Psi
A_{\mu}\rightarrow A_{\mu}+\frac{1}{e}\partial_{\mu}\chi

III. The attempt at a solution

1. First I show that D_{\mu}\Psi\rightarrow e^{-iQ\chi}D_{\mu}\Psi

D_{\mu}\Psi=(\partial_{\mu}+ieQA_{\mu})\Psi \rightarrow<br /> \left[\partial_{\mu}+ieQ\left(A_{\mu}+\frac{1}{e}\partial_{\mu}\chi\right)\right] <br /> e^{-iQ\chi}\Psi =

=\left(\partial_{\mu}+ieQA_{\mu}+iQ\partial_{\mu}\chi\right) <br /> e^{-iQ\chi}\Psi=

=e^{-iQ\chi}\left(-iQ\partial_{\mu}\chi+ieQA_{\mu}+iQ\partial_{\mu}\chi+\partial_{\mu}\right) <br /> \Psi=
=e^{-iQ\chi}\left(\partial_{\mu}+ieQA_{\mu}\right) <br /> \Psi=e^{-iQ\chi}D_{\mu}\Psi

The problem is in the third line. Where does \partial_{\mu} come from?
I get:

(iQ\partial_{\mu}\chi) <br /> e^{-iQ\chi}\Psi=\left(e^{-iQ\chi}iQ\partial_{\mu}\chi -e^{-iQ\chi}i^{2} Q^{2}\chi\partial_{\mu}\chi\right)\Psi

What am I doing wrong?

2. Then I show that F^{\mu \nu}\rightarrow F^{\mu \nu} and \overline{\Psi}\rightarrow e^{iQ\chi}\overline{\Psi}

3. And finally:

\overline{\Psi}(i\gamma^{\mu} D_{\mu} -m)\Psi\rightarrow e^{iQ\chi}\overline{\Psi}(i\gamma^{\mu}e^{-iQ\chi}D_{\mu}-m)e^{-iQ\chi}\Psi=

=e^{iQ\chi}\overline{\Psi}e^{-iQ\chi}(i\gamma^{\mu} D_{\mu} -m)\Psi=\overline{\Psi}(i\gamma^{\mu} D_{\mu} -m)\Psi

Here is the second problem. I get:

\overline{\Psi}(i\gamma^{\mu} D_{\mu} -m)\Psi\rightarrow e^{iQ\chi}\overline{\Psi}(i\gamma^{\mu}e^{-iQ\chi}D_{\mu}-m)e^{-iQ\chi}\Psi=

=e^{iQ\chi}\overline{\Psi}(i\gamma^{\mu}e^{-iQ\chi} D_{\mu}e^{-iQ\chi} -e^{-iQ\chi}m)\Psi =e^{iQ\chi}\overline{\Psi}e^{-iQ\chi}(i\gamma^{\mu} D_{\mu}e^{-iQ\chi} -m)\Psi

I can't figure out what happens here.

I will be very grateful for your help.
 
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that is one weird way of doing this

I don't understand your first problem since the derivative is there in the second line as well and all other previous lines. First thing to understand is that \chi is a coordinate dependent function so its derivative is non trivial. The line you put up of your solution I'm sorry to say is nonsense

the second problem seems to be orthographic in nature or arising from bad definitions, it should be

<br /> \overline{\Psi}(i\gamma^{\mu} D_{\mu} -m)\Psi\rightarrow e^{iQ\chi}\overline{\Psi}(i\gamma^{\mu}e^{-iQ\chi}D_{\mu}-me^{-iQ\chi}) \Psi<br />

since \overline{\Psi }&#039; (i\gamma^{\mu} D&#039;_{\mu} -m)\Psi &#039; = e^{iQ\chi}\overline{\Psi}(i\gamma^{\mu}D&#039;_{\mu}-m)e^{-iQ\chi} \Psi

and you have already shown that D&#039;_{\mu} \Psi &#039; = e^{-iQ\chi} D_{\mu} \Psi
 
sgd37 said:
that is one weird way of doing this

Can you provide a reference to better solution for this problem? This one is from lecture notes.

sgd37 said:
First thing to understand is that \chi is a coordinate dependent function so its derivative is non trivial.

This made me think, and i realized that I should use (fg)'=f'g+fg' to the first \partial _{\mu} not the second one. Now I get it.

sgd37 said:
the second problem seems to be orthographic in nature or arising from bad definitions, it should be

<br /> \overline{\Psi}(i\gamma^{\mu} D_{\mu} -m)\Psi\rightarrow e^{iQ\chi}\overline{\Psi}(i\gamma^{\mu}e^{-iQ\chi}D_{\mu}-me^{-iQ\chi}) \Psi<br />

since \overline{\Psi }&#039; (i\gamma^{\mu} D&#039;_{\mu} -m)\Psi &#039; = e^{iQ\chi}\overline{\Psi}(i\gamma^{\mu}D&#039;_{\mu}-m)e^{-iQ\chi} \Psi

and you have already shown that D&#039;_{\mu} \Psi &#039; = e^{-iQ\chi} D_{\mu} \Psi

Of course. I tried to transform \Psi twice.

Thank you very much!
 
With all due respect, but the problem you're trying to solve is logically circular. The Noether procedure to couple the free fields specifically uses the invariance of the overall coupled action to derive the coupling term. Otherwise, the j^{\mu}A_{\mu} coupling couldn't be derived.
 
I think you're turning a simple exercise into something it was never intended to demonstrate
 

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