Learn the Art of Indexology to Writing Lagrangians with Tensors

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of "indexology" in the context of writing Lagrangians using tensors. Participants explore the conditions necessary for a Lagrangian beyond merely being a scalar, as well as seeking references and clarifications on isotropic tensors.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses interest in indexology as a method for writing Lagrangians based on dimensionality and tensor contraction.
  • Another participant questions the sufficiency of this approach, noting that a Lagrangian must meet additional conditions beyond being a scalar.
  • Several references are shared, including a book on topological insulators and a PDF on relativity, though some participants express skepticism about their usefulness.
  • A participant clarifies that the first reference does provide useful information regarding the conditions a Lagrangian must satisfy for electromagnetic fields.
  • Further inquiries are made about isotropic tensors, specifically why only the tensors ##\delta_{\alpha\beta}## and ##\epsilon_{\mu\nu\lambda}## are considered isotropic, with a request for more detailed references.
  • Additional links to resources on isotropic tensors are provided by a participant, suggesting that Google can be a helpful tool for further exploration.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the sufficiency of indexology for writing Lagrangians, and there is ongoing uncertainty regarding the definition and examples of isotropic tensors.

Contextual Notes

Participants express limitations in their understanding of isotropic tensors and the specific conditions required for Lagrangians, indicating a need for further clarification and exploration of these concepts.

taishizhiqiu
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I recently read that indexology is the art of writing a Lagrangian by just knowing how many dimensions it has and how to contract tensors. I am very interested in this technique, but I cannot find any reference. Can anyone give me a guidance or a reference?
 
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Um... You read this where? You might get a scalar from this. But a Lagrangian has to satisfy a few more conditions than just being a scalar.
 
taishizhiqiu said:

Actually, the first one does help. It talks about the other conditions a Lagrangian must satisfy for an electromagnetic field. That is, you need more than just the dimension and how to contract tensors.
 
DEvens said:
Actually, the first one does help. It talks about the other conditions a Lagrangian must satisfy for an electromagnetic field. That is, you need more than just the dimension and how to contract tensors.
Oh, I think I didn't express myself clearly.

The first book is where I first read about indexology and that's why I asked such a question.

I basically understand the technique. What I want to know is more details. For example, I don't know why only ##\delta_{\alpha\beta}## and ##\epsilon_{\mu\nu\lambda}## is the only two isotropic tensors and I don't even know what are isotropic tensors. That's why I am here asking for reference.
 
taishizhiqiu said:
I basically understand the technique. What I want to know is more details. For example, I don't know why only ##\delta_{\alpha\beta}## and ##\epsilon_{\mu\nu\lambda}## is the only two isotropic tensors and I don't even know what are isotropic tensors. That's why I am here asking for reference.

Google is your friend.

http://mathworld.wolfram.com/IsotropicTensor.html
http://www.damtp.cam.ac.uk/user/reh10/lectures/nst-mmii-chapter3.pdf
http://www2.ph.ed.ac.uk/~rhorsley/SI12-13_socm/lec08.pdf
https://www.physicsforums.com/threads/isotropic-tensors.106292/
 

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