Manipulating Formulas with Derivatives

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SUMMARY

The discussion centers on manipulating thermodynamic formulas using derivatives, specifically focusing on the enthalpy equation H = U + PV and the differential dU = TdS - PdV. The user, Bernie, successfully derives dH as dH = TdS + VdP but questions whether he is missing a step in specifying the derivative's respect. A response highlights the use of differential forms, emphasizing their similarity to the chain rule and their properties in calculus. The conversation illustrates the application of differential forms in thermodynamics and the importance of understanding the mathematical rigor behind derivatives.

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  • Understanding of thermodynamic equations, specifically enthalpy and internal energy.
  • Familiarity with calculus, particularly differentiation and the chain rule.
  • Basic knowledge of differential forms and their properties.
  • Concept of generalized coordinates in state space.
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  • Study the properties and applications of differential forms in calculus.
  • Learn about the mathematical foundations of thermodynamics, focusing on enthalpy and internal energy.
  • Explore the chain rule in more depth, particularly in the context of multivariable calculus.
  • Investigate the role of generalized coordinates in physics and their relation to state space.
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Students and professionals in physics and engineering, particularly those studying thermodynamics, calculus, and differential geometry.

Bernie Hunt
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The Problem;
Given H = U + PV and dU = TdS - PdV
Find dH in terms of T, S, P, V

My Solution;

H = U + PV
dH = dU + PdV + VdP
dH = (TdS - PdV) + PdV + VdP
dH = Tds + VdP

My Question

Am I missing a step between the first and second steps? I'm taking the derivative of both sides, but not specifying what the derivative is in respect to. (bad English, sorry)

I learn this short hand from some physics guys, but I'm looking for the strict mathematical method.
Any suggestions?

Thanks,
Bernie
 
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One way to make sense of what they're doing is via differential forms. If the sequence xi are generalized coordinates on (a local patch of) the state space, so that any function f on the state space can be represented as a function of the xi's, then one property of differential forms is that

[tex] df = \sum_i \frac{\partial f}{\partial x_i} dx_i,[/tex]

which, formally, looks just like the chain rule. Because of the formal similarity, differentials share many of the same properties as derivatives, such as
d(fg) = f dg + g df.​

(Some formulations of differential forms take this property as part of the definition)



(In differential geometry, it is customary to write i as a superscript, not a subscript. But I wrote it this way because I figured it was probably more familiar to you. In particular, so that it doesn't look like exponentiation)
 
Last edited:
Thanks for your reply Hurkyl.

I haven't had DE yet, so I can't really comment on your reply.

Bernie
 

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